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Randy Moss the Greatest NFL Player of All time

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Postby goleafsgo96 » Wed Jan 12, 2005 6:44 pm

Barry is number one in my books. Maybe he didnt play "enough" but i greatest is a synonym for best for me, and he was THE best.
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Postby Calyxes » Wed Jan 12, 2005 7:04 pm

no
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Postby SeaWolf » Wed Jan 12, 2005 7:38 pm

Carolina Culpepper wrote:If I remember right it was Marino who broke Unitas's single season TD record that Manning now has broken. Unitas did it in a 14 game season, not 16.


I agree that Unitas was great, but what game did Manning pass Unitas this year. If Manning did it in game 14 or sooner, than the point is moot. If he did it in games 15 or 16 than your correct.
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Postby mtryanks12 » Wed Jan 12, 2005 7:58 pm

SeaWolf wrote:
Carolina Culpepper wrote:If I remember right it was Marino who broke Unitas's single season TD record that Manning now has broken. Unitas did it in a 14 game season, not 16.


I agree that Unitas was great, but what game did Manning pass Unitas this year. If Manning did it in game 14 or sooner, than the point is moot. If he did it in games 15 or 16 than your correct.


football was less focused on passign back then.
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Postby eaglesrule » Thu Jan 13, 2005 10:42 am

no one could stop jim brown. that guy was ubeliveable. the best is not barry sanders. I really don't know how the discussion pretty much isn't limited to brown, unitas rice.

The one thing that bugs me, is I am not ready to summarily dismiss modern players from the discussion. rice was the bomb. 20 td's in a season? come on now.

But with the wayother players revere brown, its tough to go against him.
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Postby kevinoc81 » Thu Jan 13, 2005 11:14 am

eaglesrule wrote:The one thing that bugs me, is I am not ready to summarily dismiss modern players from the discussion. rice was the bomb. 20 td's in a season? come on now.


I also have a probelm with this. Not that I would ever say Manning is the best player ever, but I don't think it's right to say, "he can't be considered because the game was less focused on the pass back then." Things change, the game changes. Can Payton not be used in the same sentence as Brown because he had better shoulder pads and helmets. Advancements in the way the game is played or the equipment players use can't keep them out of the discussion. You can't say that Marino, Montana, Elway, and some day maybe Manning are not as good as Unitas because the game was less focused on the pass back then. For Unitas to do the things he did the Colts had to be somewhat focused on the pass.

Again, I'm not saying any of these guys are better than Unitas, but I'm just saying that you can't count modern guys out automatically because of the changes in the equipment or the way the game is played.
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Postby eaglesrule » Thu Jan 13, 2005 2:25 pm

exactly. you also have, relative to the population, less spots to go around, and waaay more money involved -- so I think the comeptition level is higher, not lower than back in the day. When you throw in the evolution of the modern defense, I think any modern candidate for best ever (qb) would have some pluses in his column.

If the game wa sless pass-orineted, you could probably make the case that comparitively, the db's weren't as good either, as they weren't as necessary as linemen. Maybe it was relatively easier for the team who actually decided to pass, because it was more novel? (I don't know, just making an argument)
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Postby Carolina Culpepper » Thu Jan 13, 2005 4:39 pm

eaglesrule wrote:exactly. you also have, relative to the population, less spots to go around, and waaay more money involved -- so I think the comeptition level is higher, not lower than back in the day. When you throw in the evolution of the modern defense, I think any modern candidate for best ever (qb) would have some pluses in his column.

If the game wa sless pass-orineted, you could probably make the case that comparitively, the db's weren't as good either, as they weren't as necessary as linemen. Maybe it was relatively easier for the team who actually decided to pass, because it was more novel? (I don't know, just making an argument)
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Another thing to look at is how did their stats compare to others in the same time frame. Are they substantially ahead of all others. For instance in Baseball the thing that makes Babe Ruth stand out is that he was hitting 30, 40, 50 HR's a year at a time when the second best guy was hitting in the teen's or low 20's. Similiarly Manning, who I think clearly is the best at this time is putting up some great numbers, but they aren't that much ahead of others, especially in yards. But Unitas was throwing 30 to 40 TD's a year when most QB's were in the low 20's at best. That makes him stand out. Let me give you another example, when you talk about the best WR of all time rarely do you hear Don Hudson's name mentioned (former Packer now in the Hall of Fame). He may be the best ever because when you look at his stats compared to his contemporaries, they were WAY better. You just don't hear much about him today because his stats back then aren't that incredible when matched to the numbers being put up by today's WR each year. An interesting thing to consider.
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