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ODotW: Part 8, Top TE's

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Postby UNDEFEATED » Tue Apr 12, 2005 3:47 am

Santacruzer wrote:
deluxe_247 wrote:im kinda surprised at those of you who are ranking witten at #3 above heap and crump. im not so sure that he will put up the same numbers as last year with a new qb. i can see an argument about witten vs crump...but witten vs heap...hmmm


I ahve to agree that some people may be everlooking Heap. I am big on Witten, but I still thing Heap is a shoe-in for at least the 3rd spot.

Crumpler I can see below Witten because you never know what you're going to get from Vick.


Its not knock on heap. I am big on heap too. But Heap has never really played with a serious WR on his team. Mason and him are going to share the ball. Boller has enough problems getting completions as is. But with mason in the picture Witten is a better option. And Bledsoe likes to throw to TEs.
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Postby Gunslinger » Tue Apr 12, 2005 5:34 am

deluxe_247 wrote:im kinda surprised at those of you who are ranking witten at #3 above heap and crump. im not so sure that he will put up the same numbers as last year with a new qb. i can see an argument about witten vs crump...but witten vs heap...hmmm


I have Witten, Crumpler, and Heap in a tier and couldn't really tell you who of the 3 will do better. I do think Witten has a good chance of repeating and even improving on last year's numbers.
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Postby LT Blue Colt » Tue Apr 12, 2005 7:28 am

1.) A. Gates
2.) T. Gonzalez
3.) J. Witten
4.) A. Crumpler
5.) R. McMichael
6.) J. Shockey
7.) J. Wiggins
8.) T. Heap
9.) D. Clark
10.) E. Johnson
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Postby Trainer of Dolphins » Tue Apr 12, 2005 10:12 am

I think Witten will be just fine. I remember a guy named Ben Coates who had a pretty decent career with Bledsoe. He went to the Pro Bowl 5 times, scored 6+ TDs 6 years in a row, and in those 6 years he nver had llesss than 600 recieving yards. His best season was in either '94 when he had 96 catches for 1,174 yards and 7TDs or '96 62 catches for 682 yards and 9 TDs.

I am not saying Witten is Caotes or the teams are the same, but Bledsoe can/will throw to the TE. Possibly more than the WRs, so I think Witten can be ranked expecting close to what we saw last year. Plus you know the Tuna loves the TE
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Postby Gunslinger » Tue Apr 12, 2005 10:21 am

Speaking of TEs, does anyone have a good feel on how Saban uses his TEs? I have no idea if he used them a lot at LSU but I like McMichaels and would hope he wouldn't ignore him.
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Postby Santacruzer » Tue Apr 12, 2005 11:13 am

Trainer of Dolphins wrote:I think Witten will be just fine. I remember a guy named Ben Coates who had a pretty decent career with Bledsoe. He went to the Pro Bowl 5 times, scored 6+ TDs 6 years in a row, and in those 6 years he nver had llesss than 600 recieving yards. His best season was in either '94 when he had 96 catches for 1,174 yards and 7TDs or '96 62 catches for 682 yards and 9 TDs.


1994 was an awfully long time ago......

Yeah, I remember how great all those Buffalo TEs were the last couple of years. :-t

You have to remember that Bledsoe hasn't looked all that great the last few years, even with decent WRs, or at least better ones than there are in Dallas anyways. I know he is hooking back up with his "coach", and he even made Vinny look not too bad last year, but I am not looking for MONSTER #'s out of Bledsoe.

All that said, I DO like Witten, and he will put up great #'s for a TE, will probably finish top 5 for TEs, etc. But you have to consider Heap should do better with the fact that there will be somebody else there who can actually catch a ball or two, and have defenses not "focus" just on Heap. I am not on the Boller bandwagon, but he should see some improvement as well with having some decent players running routes for once.

This is a tough arguement to make. I think Heap and Witten are probably equally talented, so you have to look at the systems they are in. Because both QBs are not the best, it's still a pretty tough call, but I personally think Baltimore will do better this year, and have more redzone opportunities.
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Postby Kensat30 » Tue Apr 12, 2005 12:27 pm

deluxe_247 wrote:im kinda surprised at those of you who are ranking witten at #3 above heap and crump. im not so sure that he will put up the same numbers as last year with a new qb. i can see an argument about witten vs crump...but witten vs heap...hmmm


Heap was the #3 TE behind Shockey and Gonzalez until last year because of the lack of other "Gonzalez like TEs". Heap's career high for receptions(~70) yardage (~850) and TDs (6), which came 3 years ago in 2002, are all just equal to or below what several other TEs accomplished last year. Basically, Heap's injury allowed other TEs to develop and leapfrog him.

And don't be mistaken here, Heap's main value lied in the fact that he WAS the only WR option in Baltimore. More targets = more catches = more production. Having a proven 80+ reception WR in Baltimore will only hurt Heap's fantasy outlook. Gonzalez, Gates, and Witten are the undisputed #1 WR options on their teams and have proved their worth over Heap statistically in every way possible.

Heap and Shockey both have to take a hit in their rankings due to both the emergance of other TEs in 2004 AND the acquistions made by their teams in the offseason (Baltimore/Mason, NY/Plaxico).

List of the TEs that have surpassed Heap/Shockey career highs in 2004 alone: (Notice the common names, I bolded them to make it easier).

Receptions-
<b>Gonzalez (102)
Witten (87)</b>
Johnson (82)
<b>Gates (81)</b>


Yards-
<b>Gonzalez (1258)
Witten (980)
Gates (964)</b>

TDs-
<b>Gates (13)
Gonzalez (7)</b>
Graham (7)
Franks (7)
<b>Witten (6)</b>
Crumpler (6)
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Postby mtryanks12 » Tue Apr 12, 2005 2:36 pm

Personally, I think it's tough for WR's and TE's to get accustomed to a different QB thworing the ball to them, and that's why I'm lower on witten this year. Bledsoe does like to throw to TE's, but with a new QB, I see witten getting a ton of looks but fewer receptions than last year, but still similar numbers.
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Postby chaindog35 » Tue Apr 12, 2005 2:49 pm

1. Gates
2. Gonzo
3. Witten
4. Heap
5. Crumpler
6. Shockey
7. Dallas Clark
8. McMichael
9. Wiggins
10. Winslow
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Postby MadScott » Tue Apr 12, 2005 5:50 pm

Kensat30 wrote:I see Wiggins on a lot of draft lists, but aren't you guys worried about Kleinsasser?

3)Jason Witten
4)Jeremy Shockey
5)Alge Crumpler
6)Todd Heap
-----
7)Eric Johnson
8)Kellen Winslow
9)Randy McMichael
10)Dallas Clark
----
10b)Ben Troupe
I agree with Kensat's rankings, perhaps with Shockey and Heap interchanged if Heap is healthy. And finally some love for EJ. Seems like an awful lot of folks forgot how productive this guy was last year. With the WR situation not being much better this year in SF, there's no reason to think he can't do it again.
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