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Worst Trade of the year.... ruins league?

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Postby Plindsey88 » Thu Sep 22, 2005 12:12 pm

Heimholder wrote:Unless the guy getting McCardell is already totally stacked at WR and obviously doesn't need him, I would say this is fine. Yeah it looks unfair to most of us, but looking at both players' performance thus far, it's not that much of a stretch. You can't penalize a shrewd owner for finding a desparate guy in need of a startable WR...

- Coach Hog



Exactly.... Rosters make a very big difference.... Let me give you an example of where this trade is perfectly fair:

Team A:

RB: Deuce, Dom, Caddy, LJ, Willie Parker
WR: Javon Walker, Nate Burleson, Rod Smith, Troy Williamson, Eric Parker

Team B:

RB: Jamal Lewis, Kevin Jones, Duce Staley, Michael Bennett
WR: Chad Johnson, Michael Clayton, Santana Moss, Keenan McCardell, Robert Ferguson



In this circumstance, Team A does not need Dom Davis, and in fact will likely never have call to start him, but he DOES need some WR help in the worst kind of way....

Team B really has very little use for Keenan McCardell... He can get by without him, but he needs some serious RB help with Jamal and KJ underproducing in the worst kind of way....

The trade is a good one for both squads... Why should it be vetoed?
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Postby Pete123444 » Thu Sep 22, 2005 12:16 pm

D D for S Moss and Bennett would be more "fair".
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Postby Matthias » Thu Sep 22, 2005 2:10 pm

Plindsey88 wrote:
Heimholder wrote:Unless the guy getting McCardell is already totally stacked at WR and obviously doesn't need him, I would say this is fine. Yeah it looks unfair to most of us, but looking at both players' performance thus far, it's not that much of a stretch. You can't penalize a shrewd owner for finding a desparate guy in need of a startable WR...

- Coach Hog



Exactly.... Rosters make a very big difference.... Let me give you an example of where this trade is perfectly fair:

Team A:

RB: Deuce, Dom, Caddy, LJ, Willie Parker
WR: Javon Walker, Nate Burleson, Rod Smith, Troy Williamson, Eric Parker

Team B:

RB: Jamal Lewis, Kevin Jones, Duce Staley, Michael Bennett
WR: Chad Johnson, Michael Clayton, Santana Moss, Keenan McCardell, Robert Ferguson



In this circumstance, Team A does not need Dom Davis, and in fact will likely never have call to start him, but he DOES need some WR help in the worst kind of way....

Team B really has very little use for Keenan McCardell... He can get by without him, but he needs some serious RB help with Jamal and KJ underproducing in the worst kind of way....

The trade is a good one for both squads... Why should it be vetoed?


i'm unclear. are you saying that this IS the circumstances or COULD BE the circumstances?

the way i view it is that the individual rosters are not that important. what is important is the league scoring, number of teams, and number of starting positions. in a 10-person league that started 1 rb, no flex, and 5 wr's, this trade looks reasonable. in a normal league that started 2 rb's, 1 flex, and 2 or 3 wr's, this trade isn't close to fair. the owner getting davis should be able to, either this week or shortly, flip davis for a wr along the lines of holt, chad, or hines, or even conceivably owens or moss if davis takes an upswing.

and that's the point. the davis owner is getting twenty-five cents on the dollar for his player, giving the other owner a bounty which could then unbalance the league. put another way: if there was no collusion, but an owner decided on draft day to trade away his first-round draft spot for someone else's seventh-rounder, would anybody object? is it ok for someone to just be stupid? if you think that you would make noise on draft day, then can you distinguish why it is different here?

(note: owners do have the right to make stupid selections on draft day... picking vick in the second round, for example. these things, however, are different as it doesn't directly benefit any one owner at the expense of everybody else. the pool of available, draftable players just remains one bigger for everybody. when you're talking trades, though, you're talking one person making a bad decision, one owner being the direct beneficiary of that decision, and the competitive nature of the league as a whole being damaged).

but i do agree with wesley who said the important thing is to have the veto mechanism in place ahead of time. and then these questions of whether or not someone should vote against isn't really an issue. you have the system. if it gets vetoed under the system, it's vetoed. end of story.
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Postby BrutallyHuge » Thu Sep 22, 2005 2:13 pm

Matthias wrote:the way i view it is that the individual rosters are not that important.


You're wrong. They are important.
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Postby Matthias » Thu Sep 22, 2005 3:07 pm

BrutallyHuge wrote:
Matthias wrote:the way i view it is that the individual rosters are not that important.


You're wrong. They are important.


not to the fairness of the trade. if i trade you eddie kennison and get shaun alexander; it doesn't matter if i'm stacked at rb and weak at wr. i'll find a buyer for alexander and get back a wr superior to kennison.

so what's important is how valuable is this player to your league. which is deterined by league settings, number of teams, and number of players at each position. put another way, if what i want is japanese yen, and have american dollars, if someone offers me a better-than-market exchange rate for euro's... i'll do that, flip the euro's for yen, and come out ahead on the deal.

in that sense, the individual rosters don't really matter that much.
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Postby matmat » Thu Sep 22, 2005 3:10 pm

lol. maybe that's the best WR he could get for DD? maybe the rest of you didn't want to deal with him? the trade is a little skewed, but close to fair. vetoing would be unreasonable.
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Postby BeefSandwiches » Thu Sep 22, 2005 3:13 pm

Matthias wrote:
BrutallyHuge wrote:
Matthias wrote:the way i view it is that the individual rosters are not that important.


You're wrong. They are important.


not to the fairness of the trade. if i trade you eddie kennison and get shaun alexander; it doesn't matter if i'm stacked at rb and weak at wr. i'll find a buyer for alexander and get back a wr superior to kennison.

so what's important is how valuable is this player to your league. which is deterined by league settings, number of teams, and number of players at each position. put another way, if what i want is japanese yen, and have american dollars, if someone offers me a better-than-market exchange rate for euro's... i'll do that, flip the euro's for yen, and come out ahead on the deal.

in that sense, the individual rosters don't really matter that much.


I completely disagree.

If a trade makes my team better, which trading a non-starting RB for someone you would start at WR does, then I don't care who the league thinks is getting the better end of the deal. I don't think a team should suffer because they are very strong in one area and weak in another.
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