treat24 wrote:It's actually his holier than thou christian attitude... he is always right, everyone else is wrong. christianity is the only way to go, other beliefs are wrong... he is a perfect christian, his poo doesn't stink... had a diva attitude touring... he is better than everyone else, doing god's work, he's a gift to the world from god... etc etc
do some googling... you'll find some fun stories about how he is the greatest thing ever... or so he thinks...
obviously fame changed him from the man JB met...
even christians began cringing at how extreme he became about it... hence the funny pic...
he also got his ass kicked by 311 when he was torched drunk at some hotel and was trying to hit on one of 311's woman. not a big fan of 311, but that was awesome.
We must not confuse dissent from disloyalty. We will not walk in fear, one of another, we will not be driven by fear into an age of unreason.
my words but a whisper -- your deafness a shout i may make you feel -- but i can't make you think
treat24 wrote:It's actually his holier than thou christian attitude... he is always right, everyone else is wrong. christianity is the only way to go, other beliefs are wrong... he is a perfect christian, his poo doesn't stink... had a diva attitude touring... he is better than everyone else, doing god's work, he's a gift to the world from god... etc etc
do some googling... you'll find some fun stories about how he is the greatest thing ever... or so he thinks...
obviously fame changed him from the man JB met...
even christians began cringing at how extreme he became about it... hence the funny pic...
That's a common perception about him, but no one can ever really back it up. At what point does he say he's better than everyone else? If anything, a portion of the lyrics from his song "With Arms Wide Open" that he wrote to his unborn son, speak the opposite.
If I had just one wish Only one demand I hope he's not like me I hope he understands That he can take this life And hold it by the hand And he can greet the world With arms wide open...
What about the W.A.W.O. (With Arms Wide Open) foundation he created to promote healthy parent-child relationships?
Here are some lyrics from "Higher"
Although I would like our world to change It helps me to appreciate Those nights and those dreams But, my friend, I'd sacrifice all those nights If I could make the Earth and my dreams the same The only difference is To let love replace all our hate So let's go there Let's make our escape Come on, let's go there Let's ask can we stay?
His song "My Own Prison" hints that he feels maybe he's not good enough to go to heaven.
His song "One" promotes unity and doing away with discrimination.
If you knew anything about Scott Stapp other than what the media has told you, you'd know he's not Mr. Full of Himself. If anything his strict Christian upbringing has caused him to question himself and whether he's good enough or not. His lyrics convey those feelings.
Everyone wants to crucify him for getting the big head, but his band broke numerous sales records mostly because of him. It'd be a little hard not to feel proud of your accomplishments don't you think? I just don't get why people like him get criticized to the Nth degree but rap music is the most popular genre of music out there. Maybe if Stapp had sung about getting laid and drinking beer and smoking weed and committing crimes instead of racial unity and love, he'd get more people's approval.
treat24 wrote:It's actually his holier than thou christian attitude... he is always right, everyone else is wrong. christianity is the only way to go, other beliefs are wrong... he is a perfect christian, his poo doesn't stink... had a diva attitude touring... he is better than everyone else, doing god's work, he's a gift to the world from god... etc etc
do some googling... you'll find some fun stories about how he is the greatest thing ever... or so he thinks...
obviously fame changed him from the man JB met...
even christians began cringing at how extreme he became about it... hence the funny pic...
That's a common perception about him, but no one can ever really back it up. At what point does he say he's better than everyone else? If anything, a portion of the lyrics from his song "With Arms Wide Open" that he wrote to his unborn son, speak the opposite.
If I had just one wish Only one demand I hope he's not like me I hope he understands That he can take this life And hold it by the hand And he can greet the world With arms wide open...
What about the W.A.W.O. (With Arms Wide Open) foundation he created to promote healthy parent-child relationships?
Here are some lyrics from "Higher"
Although I would like our world to change It helps me to appreciate Those nights and those dreams But, my friend, I'd sacrifice all those nights If I could make the Earth and my dreams the same The only difference is To let love replace all our hate So let's go there Let's make our escape Come on, let's go there Let's ask can we stay?
His song "My Own Prison" hints that he feels maybe he's not good enough to go to heaven.
His song "One" promotes unity and doing away with discrimination.
If you knew anything about Scott Stapp other than what the media has told you, you'd know he's not Mr. Full of Himself. If anything his strict Christian upbringing has caused him to question himself and whether he's good enough or not. His lyrics convey those feelings.
Everyone wants to crucify him for getting the big head, but his band broke numerous sales records mostly because of him. It'd be a little hard not to feel proud of your accomplishments don't you think? I just don't get why people like him get criticized to the Nth degree but rap music is the most popular genre of music out there. Maybe if Stapp had sung about getting laid and drinking beer and smoking weed and committing crimes instead of racial unity and love, he'd get more people's approval.
WAWO is about the only thing you mentioned that I'll take and go "ok... good job Stapp"
He's backed his image up with his actions and off stage words over the years... People can write songs about anything they want. Should we go arrest Nate Dogg and Warren G... If song lyrics are true... sounds like they killed a few people back in 1992... Two of the three songs you mentioned are off their first album undoubtedly written before he was famous, the 3rd was written about the birth of his child... bound to be sentimental. All parents wish for the absolute best for their kids, dare I say for their kids to be better than them and have a better life... Lyrics can convey anything you want.. they can say anything you want... There are stories upon stories about the crap he has done and said on tours... his actions speak louder than the crap he made up put on a lyric page and sang about... don't take his songs so literal... He's a Christian singer... of course they will have lyrics like that...
We are talking about a Christian singer with a sex tape with a bunch of teenage girls. While getting a BJ in it he proclaims "Hey...it's good to be the king." Real "questioning of himself" there. I have a link to that video if you'd like it... We're talking about a Christian singer who went ballistic on a flight during his honeymoon and wasn't allowed to fly and blew that he was too drunk to fly... We are talking about a Christian singer who was also once arrested for assault and domestic violence for throwing a bottle at his wife's head... it was later plead down to a misdemeaner.... He then had to submit to random drug and alcohol testing after released form jail because his wife said he was a drunk and drug addict (which he was throughout his career so it's not hard to believe that he hadn't stopped)... I'm not saying he's a wife beater like many have... but I've known 2 women that called the police on their husbands. Both were abused a lot and beaten many times before they finally got to the breaking point where they had to call the cops and have their husbands charged. Being that Stapp has been an alcoholic and drug addict, I don't think that lifestyle is a stretch here. Making a woman "fear for her life" as she said she did... is not cool. and those are just a few things... There are plenty of other things he's said and done that prove the common belief on him.
You made a weak argument man and you've convinced me of nothing. You can go ahead and defend the wife attacking, drunk, sex tape making, arrogant christian rocker who has had drug and alcohol problems throughout his career... go for it... you're reasoning is because his lyrics promote good things...
On a side note... I hope his kid is not like him... the world needs less people like that. Hopefully he doesn't see his dad drinking, doing drugs, and attacking his wife and think that it is ok...
treat24
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I am a Christian and a huge Christian music fan. I can't stand Creed because of what Treat posted. He is a horrible example of a Christian. He has frequently come out and tried to "make up" with the Christian fans he has, but it always seems to have another story come out like those.
joelamosobadiah wrote:I am a Christian and a huge Christian music fan. I can't stand Creed because of what Treat posted. He is a horrible example of a Christian. He has frequently come out and tried to "make up" with the Christian fans he has, but it always seems to have another story come out like those.
What treat described isn't a horrible example of a Christian, it's a horrible example of being a human being. There are good people and bad people and religion has nothing to do with it. These types of comments imply that Christians are morally superior or better than non-Christians which is one of the reasons why people get so aggravated with them. From all of my experience, there is absolutely NOTHING to indicate that on average Christians are better people than non-Christians. For some reason, however, most still think they are.
Supposedly some 80% of the country is Christian, right? You telling me that 80% or 70% or 60% or 50% of these people are better people than the 20% that aren't Christians? If you think this, you're crazy.
Setting the Christian aspect aside, religion in general is a model of guidelines for morals. This helps people frame their lives around a set of values that is generally appreciated and accepted as moral. That is why it is often assumed that a man with guidelines for morality is going to be more moral (or at least have a better reason for being moral) than a man without any reason. Does that make sense? You can suggest that you're a good person simply because you know what a good person is or should be. But how do you know this if it wasn't worked into your brain at some point. Most likely derived from religion at some point. That's why Scott Stapp is a worse person than Kid Rock. At least Kid Rock doesn't say he's something and then do something else. God despises the lukewarm.
Omaha Red Sox wrote:Setting the Christian aspect aside, religion in general is a model of guidelines for morals. This helps people frame their lives around a set of values that is generally appreciated and accepted as moral. That is why it is often assumed that a man with guidelines for morality is going to be more moral (or at least have a better reason for being moral) than a man without any reason. Does that make sense? You can suggest that you're a good person simply because you know what a good person is or should be. But how do you know this if it wasn't worked into your brain at some point. Most likely derived from religion at some point. That's why Scott Stapp is a worse person than Kid Rock. At least Kid Rock doesn't say he's something and then do something else. God despises the lukewarm.
Implying that people without religion lack a model of guidelines for morals is exactly what I'm talking about. Implying that religion is a prerequisite for having a model of guidelines for morals is just plain bad logic. If it were true, every child of an atheist or agnostic would be a bad person without any morals. Some of the most thoughtful, loving people I've met were not raised up religious. How can that be?
Some people don't need the promise of an afterlife to make the determination that lieing, cheating and stealing is wrong. People don't need the promise of an afterlife to have a conscience. For some, the promise of an afterlife and belief that they're "saved" actually gives them license to do what they want. Who cares how much bad stuff I do when i know I'll be forgiven? Continuing to act like you're superior only greatens the divide and pushes more people away from religion. Why do you think it's becoming more and more commonly acceptable to bash religion and the religious. It's not just because people are "haters". There's something to it. Christians, generally speaking, are no better or worse than anybody else. Failing to see this will only further alienate you from non-Christians. (when I say "you", I don't mean Omaha. I'm speaking generally)
I don't know the best way to articulate it, but I really believe that "love" is the key. People that have the ability to love are the ones that I believe end up making the best people. Being able to love is at the source of most of life's most selfless things. Being raised in a loving environment and being taught how to love is more influential in making someone a better person than religion could ever dream of.
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