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Steve Smith vs. Terrell Owens

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Postby Bowie » Tue Jan 24, 2006 5:44 pm

The Eagles did not violate any NFL rules by punishing TO, and the Panthers won't be violating any when they let Steve Smith slide. Each team did what they thought to be in their best interests, and had every right to do so under NFL rules (and the players' contracts). Do you really think that once one team sets a precident, all other teams should have to follow that precident? Are NFL teams not independantly owned and operated?
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Postby merc » Tue Jan 24, 2006 6:31 pm

The Eagles did not violate any NFL rules by punishing TO, and the Panthers won't be violating any when they let Steve Smith slide. Each team did what they thought to be in their best interests, and had every right to do so under NFL rules (and the players' contracts).
Right, but none of that makes it any less unfair or inequitous(ooh another new word :-D )

Do you really think that once one team sets a precident, all other teams should have to follow that precident?
Yes, as long as they all belong to the same protected monopolistic entity called the NFL. And, they would comply in a perfect world.

Are NFL teams not independantly owned and operated?
They are owned by seperate owners but they all belong to the NFL and must adhere to the NFL's rules or be punished. And, BTW, the NFL office pays very careful attention to making sure that the punishments and fines they mete out are fair and equitous to the misdeed by the member club, coach, or owner.

If this keeps up you guys are gonna force me to tell you all the story of the Blue Whale. It is a story that has beenn told by bosses to disgruntled employees for many many years. :-D
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Postby buffalobillsrul2002 » Tue Jan 24, 2006 6:43 pm

First of all, while Smith, CJ, Peyton, etc. all made their mistakes taht were slightly detrimental to the team, TO did more than that.

TO has made many comments through the media at McNabb that were distracting/detrimental, said his teammates didn't apprecitate his coming back from injury to play in the Super Bowl, told his offensive coordinator to "only speak when spoken to" or whatever, I can't remember exactly what the deal was there. He also was involved in the fight with Hugh Douglas. THere are probably more but I can't remember all of them.

So anyways, TO deserves punishment for all of these actions because he is being punished for not one thing, but the combination of all of these things. THerefore his punishment is fair and equitous to the punishments of these other guys.


Secondly, TO was given due process by the NFL. He had his case heard by an arbitrator agreed to by both sides, and the arbitrator's decision was definitely reasonable.

Thirdly, the Eagles have the right to do whatever they want to with TO. Last I checked, TOs behavior around the Eagles only had an effect on the Eagles (basically)

Fourhtly, what TO did has no comparision with wife beating, alcohol drinking, etc. The actions of these players off the field and outside the locker room has very little effects on the team. However, TO's actions within the team combined to destroy the chemistry of the Eagles. Hence, what he did deserves more punishment from the team than does any off the field mistake.

Anyways, those are the reasons why I think TOs punishment was fair and well-deserved. Feel free to disagree with me ;-D
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Postby moochman » Tue Jan 24, 2006 6:56 pm

Just as a point of clarification regarding the TO fight. Didn't some Iggle ex-player, who refered to himself as the Iggles mafia or something, confront TO and in fact cause the blow up?

I am not trying to say that TO wasn't being a total a**, but other teams deal with these things much differently. Were I an Iggle fan I would wonder why they bothered to sign him with he track record and why they did nothing to support the choice they made.

Ried, IMO, saw that his team's chances to win the SB were fading fast so out of desperation he grabbed for the brass ring by signing TO. Then once he realized that TO wasn't going to change his stripes he again got desperate. This time it was to sell out TO to his team and finally suspending him. A pretty conveniant scapegoat for a crappy job keeping the Iggles on top. Ried is lucky that McNabb is such a non-confrontational guy or Donavan just might ask what the heck Ried is doing destroying the team's focus. For his obedience, McNabb was battered into submission. No soup for you Donovan, just a sports hernia.

My long winded, and possibly ill-conceived point is that maybe Iggles' fans should start to look more into Ried's role in the disharmony on the team, not just tow the company line and say "Yeah, it was TO's fault" Look instead to who brought him in, and then didn't do anything to make him fit in.
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Postby UTLonghorns » Tue Jan 24, 2006 7:01 pm

no1cowboysfan wrote:
Slingblade wrote:T.O is a dick.

Steve Smith is not.

Case Closed.


T.O. is the best WR in the game (unfourtunately)

Steve Smith is overrated

case opened, because I know I'm getting flak for that one.


Overrated!?!

Wow, thats the most untrue statement I've ever heard.
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Postby Bowie » Tue Jan 24, 2006 7:22 pm

Merc -

1. NFL teams are franchises under the corporate umbrella of the NFL. As such, they must adhere to the rules and standards laid out in their franchisee agreement. In this case, the only applicable NFL rule involved the use of an approved moderator to settle disagreements regarding player punishments. The Eagles followed these rules exactly.

2. The NFL does pay "very careful attention to making sure that the punishments and fines they mete out are fair and equitous to the misdeed by the member club, coach, or owner." However, the TO punishment was not a league punishment, rather a team one. Team issued punishments are generally left up to the team, as long as they don't violate the player's individual contract or the CBA. That is the precident that was followed by the Eagles and upheld by the arbitrator, not some standardized system to dictate how many games being an ass should cost a player.

3. I realize I am walking into some sort of awful trap, but I'm too curious not to ask about blue whale story. What is it? (cringes)
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Postby MadScott » Wed Jan 25, 2006 12:03 am

Dear God,

Please end this thread.

Amen.
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Postby Apollo » Wed Jan 25, 2006 2:09 am

It seems to me that this is a team judgement call. The Eagles don't have to operate the way the Panthers or Colts do. The Eagles felt that Owens's behavior was hurting their chances to win more than his play was helping. The Panthers and Colts obviously don't feel Smith or Manning are at that point yet. It's a judgement call.

I think asking for "fair and equitous" treatment in a situation like this is akin to a player on the Cowboys saying he shouldn't have to hit in practice during the season because the Chiefs don't. It's not fair and equitous, but each team is doing what they think they have to do to win.

That said, I wouldn't mind seeing somebody fine the heck out of Steve Smith. Keep him from turning into Terrell Owens 3 years from now.
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Postby eaglesrule » Wed Jan 25, 2006 9:01 am

moochman wrote:Just as a point of clarification regarding the TO fight. Didn't some Iggle ex-player, who refered to himself as the Iggles mafia or something, confront TO and in fact cause the blow up?

True. He didn't have to beat his ass, then go into the locker room and say "who else wants some?" and stare donovan down though, either.

I am not trying to say that TO wasn't being a total a**, but other teams deal with these things much differently. Were I an Iggle fan I would wonder why they bothered to sign him with he track record and why they did nothing to support the choice they made.

The choice seemed pretty straightforward to me, a calculated gamble that almost worked. Everyone was saying how cheap the eagles were in FA (A faulty charge anyway) and how they need to upgrade the wr corps. When the best WR becomes aviable, you take a chance. It essentially came within three points of working, so I don't fault them. At the end of the day it was still TO's fault, not the Eagles. To argue otherwise is to say it is your fault your car got stolen because you left it unlocked. Maybe it wasn't wise, but they aren't to balme.

Ried, IMO, saw that his team's chances to win the SB were fading fast so out of desperation he grabbed for the brass ring by signing TO. Then once he realized that TO wasn't going to change his stripes he again got desperate. This time it was to sell out TO to his team and finally suspending him. A pretty conveniant scapegoat for a crappy job keeping the Iggles on top. Ried is lucky that McNabb is such a non-confrontational guy or Donavan just might ask what the heck Ried is doing destroying the team's focus. For his obedience, McNabb was battered into submission. No soup for you Donovan, just a sports hernia.

You have got to be joking. Fading Fast? With their cap room, the best Qb in the NFC in his prime and wonderful weapons in westbrook, lj smith and two good corners? Surely you jest. I find it tellign that the two nfc east playoff teams had a tough time putting the eagles away when they were starting second stringers.

My long winded, and possibly ill-conceived point is that maybe Iggles' fans should start to look more into Ried's role in the disharmony on the team, not just tow the company line and say "Yeah, it was TO's fault" Look instead to who brought him in, and then didn't do anything to make him fit in.

I think that is kind of asisnine (sorry). On one hand you have a guy who had one losing season up until now, five straight playoff berts, 4 championship games and a super bowl appearance. On the other you have a perennial, but talented malcontent.

Again, if anyone actually read the document in question, you would see that reid let an awful lot slide. He also said all the right things last year when the media was waiting for the inevitable blow up "I love TO, I love caoching a guy with his passion, etc." He made the bet with the tights, he did a lot of stuff. And the fans certianly accepted him, he was loved right from the start. Reid finally smiled for once after beating minnesota and loudly proclaimed "TO will be int he Super Bowl" he said it like a proud papa.

TO was given every opporuntiy by the organization and the fans. He would have been a philly legend, and he was dearly loved for that season. His big mistake was not going to the team in private, as the team handles all player issues in private. The never sell a player out publicly, but they expect the same in return.

What else could they have done to "make him fit in"? One would think during a super bowl run where TO was adored, he would have "fit in" by season two.

Pretty straightforward.



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Postby merc » Wed Jan 25, 2006 9:31 am

Dear God,
Please end this thread.
Amen.


Okay... this time, I am gonna end my participation in this thread so that MadScott's prayer(and all of our prayers? :-D )can be answered... hopefully, after my post.

First, just about all of the statements in this thread are correct and can coexist in the presence of each other. With this in mind, this are my conclusions with regard to the TO issue.

1. TO deserved to be punished for his misdeeds.
2. Teams can do just about whatever they want to do with their players if they act up, and each team has independent leeway with regard to punishing, or not punishing, any employee for a deed or not.
3. NFL teams are members of the NFL and are bound by their agreements to that national entity.
4. Within the framework of the player agreement, and in keeping with the conclusions above, the TO issue was handled in a legal and just way.
5. However, in light of the allowed discrepency between teams with regard to how they treat and punish(or not) like deeds, the TO punishment was unfair and inequitous on the whole.

If folks can't understand what I am saying, then I just have to give up and consider that I might be trying to communicate with folks who simply don't want to consider my viewpoint.

So, Madscott, I'll now do what I can to help answer your prayer... :-D
OUT.
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