Hall of Fame Inductees - Fantasy Football Cafe 2014 Fantasy Football Cafe


Return to Football Talk

Hall of Fame Inductees

Moderator: Football Moderators

Postby eaglesrule » Sat Feb 04, 2006 5:23 pm

you know, I think Irvin got jobbed--I hate the cowboys, but he was a force. The number one receiver on a domiant super bowl team? How does he not make it?

His stats are very impressive, 12 years he played, and he only had 4 "bad" seasons. One was his rookie year--which was good for a rookie. Two looked to be injury shortened. and one was just bad. Of one of those injury shortened years, he was on pace for over 900 yards.

He had five seasons in a row of over1,200 yards, and 7 seasons in all over 1000. Another year was just shy with 900 plus, and I mentioned the other season.

He had a monster season of 111 catches, 1600 yards and ten td's.

I think this should be a no-brainer to be honest.

And as far as monk goes, I really don't think it is THAT cut and dry. He had the first 100 catch season and is the career catches leader. But, I think a lot of that is longevity. Only a third of his career is "good". In 16 seasons, he only had 5 over 1,000 yards, and another one was close enough we can be generous and give him the sixth. Basically Irvin hada run that compared to the best of Monlk's entire work.

I know Monk was a possession recevier, but a career high of 8 td's isn't so hot. He had 11 seasons with 5 or less.

Frankly, Irvin deserves it over Monk in my opinion. His best is superirior to Monk's best.

Actually, I think Monk should maybe get in--I wouldn't fight it to the death or anything. But I hardly think he is getting jobbed. His career overlapped that of jerry rice and michael irvin and those guys eclipsed him in my opinion.

Actually, in talking about this with others, I was actually stunned that Irvin was putting up those kinds of numbers.

For basis of comaprison, considering that wr's aren't that represented in the hall, does monk compare favorably to steve largent, james lofton, jerry rice, michael irvin, lynn swann? I think he compares to swann and lofton, but even still I'd give the nod to lofton in the first example, monk in the second.

But in my opinion monk wasn't as good as rice, irvin and some of his other contemporaries. And he is going to have a hard time historically after owens and moss get in.

Owens already toasts him on td's, equals him in 1000 yard seasons, is about a year and a half/two years from besting him in yards, and has done it in 82 less games.

I jsut don't think Monk is that hall worthy.
The opening scene of the movie "Saving Private Ryan" is loosely based on games of dodgeball Brian Dawkins played in second grade.
eaglesrule
General Manager
General Manager

User avatar

Posts: 2843
Joined: 3 Dec 2003
Home Cafe: Football

Postby maddog60 » Sat Feb 04, 2006 6:00 pm

I'm not familiar with Rayfield Wright and Harry Carson, but all of the other inductees are certainly deserving. Irvin is the only one snubbed that certainly is immediately deserving. He was one of the most important pieces in what may have been the most dominant teams in football, as much as it pains me to admit that.

Monk I'm not as familiar with, but judging by his career, I'm guessing he's a guy a lot like Steve McNair will be post-retirement. An outstanding player, above the level of your average star, but not so absolutely incredible that you automatically think hall of fame. Monk's problem may be that WRs seem not to have an easy time getting in to begin with, and he's got a lot of competition to deal with every year.
maddog60
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
Fantasy ExpertCafe RankerMock(ing) Drafter
Posts: 9758
Joined: 18 Sep 2003
Home Cafe: Football

Postby MadScott » Sat Feb 04, 2006 6:15 pm

Great to see Carson and Moon get their due. Very solid class.
Image
I like simple pleasures, like butter in my ass, lollipops in my mouth. That's just me.
MadScott
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
Cafe WriterCafe RankerSweet 16 SurvivorCafe Blackjack Weekly WinnerLucky Ladders Weekly Winner
Posts: 5924
Joined: 27 Sep 2003
Home Cafe: Football

Postby beerman648 » Sat Feb 04, 2006 7:31 pm

I am hoping Derrick Thomas and Monk gets in soon. Other than that all the Inductees are really respected and well-deserving of the position of hall of famer know.
Congrats to Moon being the first Black Qb inducted.
yea i am a cheerleader. go team!!! give me a texans suck. go team! My top 2 favorite teams are in the top 5 picks(texans and titans).
beerman648
Water Boy
Water Boy


Posts: 58
Joined: 2 Jan 2006
Home Cafe: Baseball

Postby MadScott » Sun Feb 05, 2006 10:09 am

maddog60 wrote:I'm not familiar with Rayfield Wright and Harry Carson, but all of the other inductees are certainly deserving. Irvin is the only one snubbed that certainly is immediately deserving. He was one of the most important pieces in what may have been the most dominant teams in football, as much as it pains me to admit that.

Monk I'm not as familiar with, but judging by his career, I'm guessing he's a guy a lot like Steve McNair will be post-retirement. An outstanding player, above the level of your average star, but not so absolutely incredible that you automatically think hall of fame. Monk's problem may be that WRs seem not to have an easy time getting in to begin with, and he's got a lot of competition to deal with every year.
Carson was an integral part of those SB Giant teams in the early to late 80s. He and LT made up one of the more fearsome LB corps of all time.

You are pretty spot on about Monk. Monk was a pretty consistent element over time for the Redskins. Never overly flashy but always a steady producer. His numbers do warrant his induction eventually but for the large part he does get overshadowed by more flashy stars still.
Image
I like simple pleasures, like butter in my ass, lollipops in my mouth. That's just me.
MadScott
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
Cafe WriterCafe RankerSweet 16 SurvivorCafe Blackjack Weekly WinnerLucky Ladders Weekly Winner
Posts: 5924
Joined: 27 Sep 2003
Home Cafe: Football

Postby moochman » Sun Feb 05, 2006 11:10 am

I think the Cocaine Cowboy shouldn't be elected to the hall. He snorted at the rules and snorted his chances away. Heck if the oringinal LT wasn't let in, then why should they let in Irvin?
Image


I think, therefore I am. I think fantasy, therefore I am unreal?
moochman
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
CafeholicFantasy ExpertCafe RankerMock(ing) DrafterSurvival Of The Fittest WinnerMatchup Meltdown SurvivorCafe Blackjack Weekly WinnerLucky Ladders Weekly Winner
Posts: 16300
(Past Year: 80)
Joined: 20 Jul 2003
Home Cafe: Football
Location: Living in the shame only a Lions fan knows

Postby Omaha Red Sox » Sun Feb 05, 2006 12:29 pm

I like seeing Moon get in.
Omaha Red Sox
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
Cafe Ranker
Posts: 12290
Joined: 29 Jun 2005
Home Cafe: Football
Location: Probably over there

Postby Omaha Red Sox » Sun Feb 05, 2006 12:33 pm

As far as Art Monk and the longevity argument, shouldn't that count for something? The game is brutal and to be able to play nearly 2 decades and be solid during that time, I think he is deserving for sure. Irvin only led the league in receptions and yards one year during his career (93 for 1,523) in 1991. His numbers are not going to jump out at you. He was on a team full of Hall Of Famers...
Omaha Red Sox
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
Cafe Ranker
Posts: 12290
Joined: 29 Jun 2005
Home Cafe: Football
Location: Probably over there

Postby eaglesrule » Sun Feb 05, 2006 2:18 pm

as far as longevity goes, why does that make you great? I don't understand being slightly above average for a long time makes you so good. I think Monk was better than that, but longevity isn't that much of a bonus if you aren't performing at a high level.

To play devil's advocate...

Why is a guy who was a b to b- for a long time considered to be hall worthy, but a guy who was an A plus for a short time not?

Kurt Warner was a supernova of production and was an nfl mvp. For a brief time, there was no one who was better.

Can someone like ARt Monk say the same thing? He was never the best at his position.

Why do we value the longevity in such instances when we don't honor the inverse?

I don't think longevity should be rewarded if 2/3 of your career was at a mediocre production level.
The opening scene of the movie "Saving Private Ryan" is loosely based on games of dodgeball Brian Dawkins played in second grade.
eaglesrule
General Manager
General Manager

User avatar

Posts: 2843
Joined: 3 Dec 2003
Home Cafe: Football

Postby Lushcrush » Sun Feb 05, 2006 3:43 pm

eaglesrule wrote:as far as longevity goes, why does that make you great?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think longevity has allowed Monk to collect more receiving yards than anybody else currently in the Hall of Fame except Steve Largent.
If Charley Joiner deserves to be in the Hall, Monk is a slam dunk.
Image
I'm just a little Hawaiian and a homesick Island boy,
I want to go back to my fish and poi ...

[b]2005-2006 VXL Champion[/b]
Lushcrush
General Manager
General Manager

User avatar
Cafe RankerEagle EyePick 3 Weekly WinnerSweet 16 SurvivorCafe Blackjack Weekly Winner
Posts: 3055
Joined: 27 May 2002
Home Cafe: Football
Location: Down at the Spanish Moon ...

PreviousNext

Return to Football Talk

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests

Forums Articles & Tips Start & Sit Sleepers Rankings Leagues


Get Ready...
The 2014 NFL season kicks off in 20:47 hours
(and 43 days)
2014 NFL Schedule


  • Fantasy Football
  • Article Submissions
  • Privacy Statement
  • Site Survey 
  • Contact