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Postby V-unit » Mon Sep 29, 2003 3:13 am

I think Owens wants out of SF.THis is his contract year and something tells me that SF wont sign him and TO might go to some other team like the EAGLES.Owens has playing ok but just not TO style maybe its Garcia or Erickson fault dunno.
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Postby dgroundhog_ffc » Mon Sep 29, 2003 3:43 am

I doubt he gets disciplined. If he misses meetings and stuff like that, it's a different story. He's a competitor. he wants the ball, and he is vocal about it if he thinks he isn't getting it enough. Joe Horn was talking about the Colts throwing the ball to Harrison, hinting that the playcalling isn't to his liking. A WR is going to want the ball 15 times a game if he can. You can't do that every game.

Garcia is suffering a bit with his injuries I think. The entire team looks a bit lost. Firing Mooch is looking like a really bad move now.

I wonder if they like the direction the team is heading under Dennis Erickson? Mooch leading them to the playoffs apparently wasn't the direction they were looking for.
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Postby Free Bagel » Mon Sep 29, 2003 7:50 am

He got absolutely shown up by Randy Moss and he had to blame someone else for it.

It's like that commercial with "Leon" ;).

Plus, I think he was a bit jealous at the way the vikes were just willing to lob it up to Moss and let him make a play.
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Postby DiRtY BuCs » Mon Sep 29, 2003 3:15 pm

big shot wrote:the guy is yesterdays news. trade him for a chad johnson if you can


Who would trade TO for Chad Johnson. Too many people makin stupid trades early in the season. I've seen McNabb, Marvin Harrison, Travis Henry, being traded early in the season for some joke players just cuz of there first couple of games where they didnt perform as you may have wanted them to. For example I've seen Marvin Harrison traded for Byron Leftwich and Drew Bennett.

Now they feel real stupid and they should. Ya need to quick judging people based on early performances and have faith. Cuz those star players will be back. Its in there blood to perform at a high level.


Lol those Leon Commercials are sooo funny.

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Postby yoda83 » Mon Sep 29, 2003 3:27 pm

bagel, you're right. owens did get shown up. and he should be jealous of the vikes. san fran has NEVER utilized TO's talents enough. why not throw it up to him and let him grab it? i had owens last year and there were a lot of games where they didnt really even look to him until the 3rd/4th. and then they started focusing on him. and then he started making plays.

but make no mistake about it, owens is FAR AND AWAY a superior receiver to moss.
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Postby fim32 » Mon Sep 29, 2003 3:45 pm

um, good for t.o. screw the coaching staff. stupid move letting mooch go. for what?

back to the point. the niners DID throw the ball up to let t.o. try to come down with it. the problem is that garcia is NOT a deep thrower. t.o. should have come down with 2 may be 3 balls deep, possibly scoring each time! the reason he didn't? the ball hit the db in the back.

now, me being a niner fan... i dislike erickson. i think he's a boob. and not only that, where's this "down-the-field" offense he was supposed to have? in defense of the clod, tho, he doesn't have the personnel to do it. garcia is an accurate short passer, and that's what the niners have done successfully in the last 20 years. want them to throw the ball down the field? that'll take a few years: first they gotta find a new qb who has a better arm, then they have to groom him...

stupid niners. i hope to's outrage pushes the team to play better...
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Postby fntsyrookie » Mon Sep 29, 2003 4:34 pm

yoda83 wrote:
but make no mistake about it, owens is FAR AND AWAY a superior receiver to moss.


I hope you're kidding. I'm going off the top of my head here, but on ESPN they had stats over the past four or so years.

OWENS
637 catches
61 TDs
21 100+ yard games

MOSS
630 catches
61 TDs
31 100+ yard games

The stats don't lie...how is Owens "far and away" a better receiver. I don't see it.
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Postby MadScott » Mon Sep 29, 2003 5:27 pm

Another niner fan and season ticket holder chiming in here.
san fran has NEVER utilized TO's talents enough. why not throw it up to him and let him grab it?

Did you see the vikes game yesterday? I thought I was watching the second coming of JJ Stokes. The guy redefined the term alligator arms. I can think of at least a couple of instances where the ball was thrown up for TO to grab and he made no effort to go after it.
i had owens last year and there were a lot of games where they didnt really even look to him until the 3rd/4th.

As per Mooches offense. Mooch was always and will continue to be a run first guy. That's one of the things that rubbed Walsh wrong about him and lead to his undoing. They had to get TO the ball in the 2nd half because for the most part they were always trailing.
and then he started making plays.

There is no doubt that he is a playmaker but his yards/catch have continued to decrease over the last few years and he seems to drop an awful lot of balls for my taste.

Now don't get me wrong, he's still one of the three elite athletes at his position but I liken back to the Seattle Mariners of a few years back with Griffey Jr., Johnson and Rodriguez. The fear of letting any of those guys go was that there would be no way to replace them and the outlook was bleek. Yet as each individual piece left the Mariners, the team as a whole got stronger to the point where they are now a perennial contender instead of a shooting star. If the niners are smart, which I must concede is in question under current ownership, they will say goodbye to TO and opt to sign Peterson, Plummer and Streets. Simple addition by subtraction. I'm weary of the unrest that TO has caused....it's time to go TO!

To the topic at hand, I too am a TO owner and will start to entertain offers for him. It is going to really have to be something that blows my socks off though. He is a notoriously slow starter but finishes with a flurry. If you add in the fact that they are going to be battling for their playoff lives the rest of the season and TOs new contract, I maintain that he should have a career type year with well over 100 catches.
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Postby 9er Fan » Mon Sep 29, 2003 5:43 pm

fntsyrookie wrote:
yoda83 wrote:
but make no mistake about it, owens is FAR AND AWAY a superior receiver to moss.


I hope you're kidding. I'm going off the top of my head here, but on ESPN they had stats over the past four or so years.

OWENS
637 catches
61 TDs
21 100+ yard games

MOSS
630 catches
61 TDs
31 100+ yard games

The stats don't lie...how is Owens "far and away" a better receiver. I don't see it.


From 2000 - Present:

Owens: 44 TDs
Moss: 36 TDs

Both guys have different strengths/weaknesses. Moss is a better deep threat (although he's always had QBs that can throw the deep ball, unlike Owens). Moss has better hands, no question, and is faster.

Owens is the most dangerous WR in the league once he gets the ball. Bar none. He does damage all over the field (not just the fly & fade patterns), and is an awesome blocker. He also doesn't take plays off like Randy (although maybe Randy's 'tude has changed this year).

I'd rather have Owens. He's a tough posession receiver and big-play threat rolled into one (let the homer flames commence).
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Postby yoda83 » Mon Sep 29, 2003 7:26 pm

no, i didnt see the vikes' game, but i did catch all those espn clips of owens not making plays and most of what i saw were underthrown passes. and madscott, if youre a season ticket holder, then i'd imagine youre very familiar w/ all of the clutch plays owens HAS made over these past few years. i know i remember and im not even a 49ers fan.

as for mooch's offense? i dont give a sh*t. the best player the 9ers have had to bring to battle (usually the best out of both teams) has been owens. you get your best playmakers the ball. period. anything else is arrogance on the coach's part. you dont wait until the 2nd half to start trying to use your best weapon. and the crazy thing is, is how many times owens has come up clutch even w/ mooch's sad@ss philosophy. and they still underutilized him.

and as for dropping balls, moss isnt exactly known for always coming up w/ the grab. a vikings/seahawks game last year comes to mind... yeah, to's yd/catch may have dipped, but his yds and tds are still sick and steady (up until this year). and hey, moss has yet to match that rookie season of his. his sh*t's been in decline, too. especially those yds/catch: 18.7, 15.0, 12.7. see a trend? that's moss' stuff for the last three years.

if im running a real football squad and i have to choose between owens and moss, i'm taking owens and his strength, routes, hands, heart and (unfortunately) mouth over moss' baggage ("i dont play every down"; ticket cop) every time.

and fim, like i said, i didnt watch the game, but if a deep ball hits a DB in the back, how are you gonna blame the wideout?
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