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The Five-Dollar (Ethics) Question

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Am I scum?

Yes
29
94%
No
2
6%
 
Total votes : 31

Postby lmcjaho » Wed Nov 29, 2006 11:43 pm

Okay Jack, here goes.

The reason this is frowned upon is because it can quickly escalate to a situation that unbalances the league.

In your specific case it seems insignificant since as many here have pointed out you might not even have gotten the better part of the deal anyway. The problem is that if someone then made an offer of $25 + Sammy Morris for LT they could point to your trade as justification for it.

I think you can see from this short example that this is not a good direction for things to take...
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Postby logan » Thu Nov 30, 2006 12:55 am

the question also comes down to,atleast for me, would he have done the trade had you not paid him? if yes then it's not quite as bad although still a little shady. if not then its collusion as far as i'm concerned. the trade itself wasn't a bad one it's just the fact that you paid a guy to make that trade he wouldn't have made otherwise.
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Postby dgan » Thu Nov 30, 2006 1:12 am

People are OK with this? You've got to be kidding me...

This isn't real - it is fantasy. Unless you are paying the player's salary and are sending cash along with the trade (like in MLB) to essentially lower the salary owed by his new team, you are essentially paying someone to facilitate a trade they don't think is fair. That is the definition of collusion.

If you were in an auction and could give fake auction dollars away, that would probably be OK because then the person could actually use that money to improve their team. But how does $5 help this guy's team at all?

This just goes to show why I make it a point to know personally who I'm playing with - I can't believe so many people think this is ok. Nothing personal, but I wouldn't play with any of you.

EDIT: I guess two people isn't "so many"...but still more than their should be.
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Postby Matthias » Thu Nov 30, 2006 11:46 am

Word to what dgan said.

Basically, it's like you're playing 5-on-5 basketball and you pay your buddy $5 on the other team to "accidentally" turn the ball over to you once or twice. You're introducing something external to the game to influence how the game gets played out.

Quite frankly, I'm amazed that you think you need an explanation of why this is wrong.
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Postby slowride » Thu Nov 30, 2006 12:09 pm

I wouldn't say scum.....more like loser. And for $5 why even bother.
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Postby Jack » Thu Nov 30, 2006 12:23 pm

Matthias wrote:Basically, it's like you're playing 5-on-5 basketball and you pay your buddy $5 on the other team to "accidentally" turn the ball over to you once or twice. You're introducing something external to the game to influence how the game gets played out.

I like that analogy; I'll nit-pick that this scenario would be more like paying him to give me the ball openly, but the principle is the same. Thanks for your help and amazement.

Uh...and, for those who think five dollars isn't so big a deal, it's a bit bigger in this league since the pool is only forty dollars. I gave up an eighth of my potential winnings for Plaxico--and, considering the WRs I had before, I think I got a pretty good deal. Trades involving money have since been prohibited...so I guess that makes me an ethics trailblazer. (Feel free to get in your "last word" as a snappy retort to that idea, if you like.)
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Postby Deathwarmedover » Thu Nov 30, 2006 12:49 pm

For me the issue is that the $5 is outside of the realm of the game. It would be different if this were an auction league involving real $ but it isn't. This is exactly the same as one of my college leagues where our one female member slept with one of the other guys in exchange for Faulk. It flat out was not fair to the other 10 players.

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Postby Matthias » Thu Nov 30, 2006 12:51 pm

Deathwarmedover wrote:For me the issue is that the $5 is outside of the realm of the game. It would be different if this were an auction league involving real $ but it isn't. This is exactly the same as one of my college leagues where our one female member slept with one of the other guys in exchange for Faulk. It flat out was not fair to the other 10 players.

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Yes. She obviously should have slept with everyone.
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Postby Jack » Thu Nov 30, 2006 12:55 pm

Deathwarmedover wrote:For me the issue is that the $5 is outside of the realm of the game. It would be different if this were an auction league involving real $ but it isn't. This is exactly the same as one of my college leagues where our one female member slept with one of the other guys in exchange for Faulk. It flat out was not fair to the other 10 players.

You've introduced a new angle: so, if money is involved in the game somehow (other than the buy-in) then my trade is ethically kosher? I guess that's because the players' values are already measured in dollars in those leagues...but I don't see how they aren't dollar values in any league where there's a pool to be won, each player's "value" being relative to the size of the pool and how helpful he is in winning it.

I don't mean to annoy you guys by sounding like a wide-eyed newbie...but that's what I am in terms of competitive fantasy football, this being my first year of micro-managing my teams and playing at a level above "casual" competition.
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Postby Deathwarmedover » Thu Nov 30, 2006 1:03 pm

Jack wrote:You've introduced a new angle: so, if money is involved in the game somehow (other than the buy-in) then my trade is ethically kosher? I guess that's because the players' values are already measured in dollars in those leagues...but I don't see how they aren't dollar values in any league where there's a pool to be won, each player's "value" being relative to the size of the pool and how helpful he is in winning it.

I don't mean to annoy you guys by sounding like a wide-eyed newbie...but that's what I am in terms of competitive fantasy football, this being my first year of micro-managing my teams and playing at a level above "casual" competition.


Yes in fact in one of my other college leagues we all got together for our auction and bought players with real money which then became the pot for the league. I think the split was 50/20/10 with 20% going to the points winner. In this league it was common to trade players for cash and was even acceptable flat out buy players. Since everyone knew this and it was included in the league by laws it was kosher.
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