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Postby Omaha Red Sox » Thu Apr 12, 2007 10:22 am

Art Vandelay wrote:I agree with more of what you said there than you might believe, but my problem is with saying she was an unfit mother or a bad person because she was promiscuous. If you want to say that her drug abuse ruined the child's life, or the fast company she chose to keep, then I most likely wouldn't argue. But when you say "she should have kept her legs closed" I have a problem with that.


It's a generalized statement, of course, and I don't think SeaWolf meant that every woman should keep their legs closed. That would disappoint many of us who are married. I do believe a promiscuous woman makes an unfit mother, because she is not taking into account the well-being of her child. Being promiscuous obviously puts you at risk of many things. Disease, emotional distress, violence, unwanted pregnancy, etc. Things that children should not have to deal with. Parents should not burden their kids with things such as these. On top of all this is the poor example given to these kids about relationships and marriage. Instability and hopelessness.
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Postby knapplc » Thu Apr 12, 2007 10:28 am

Art Vandelay wrote:I agree with more of what you said there than you might believe, but my problem is with saying she was an unfit mother or a bad person because she was promiscuous. If you want to say that her drug abuse ruined the child's life, or the fast company she chose to keep, then I most likely wouldn't argue. But when you say "she should have kept her legs closed" I have a problem with that.

I don’t get the angst over this phrase. Maybe it’s a regional thing, but where I grew up it was a phrase meaning that a girl sleeps around, usually denoting reckless promiscuity, and a question of ethics.
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Postby treat24 » Thu Apr 12, 2007 10:38 am

knapplc wrote:
Art Vandelay wrote:I agree with more of what you said there than you might believe, but my problem is with saying she was an unfit mother or a bad person because she was promiscuous. If you want to say that her drug abuse ruined the child's life, or the fast company she chose to keep, then I most likely wouldn't argue. But when you say "she should have kept her legs closed" I have a problem with that.

I don’t get the angst over this phrase. Maybe it’s a regional thing, but where I grew up it was a phrase meaning that a girl sleeps around, usually denoting reckless promiscuity, and a question of ethics.


that's what it means in minnesota... and the bolded part is a decent description of Anna... IMHO... so i don't see the problem... :-?
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Postby Art Vandelay » Thu Apr 12, 2007 11:19 am

Omaha Red Sox wrote:It's a generalized statement, of course, and I don't think SeaWolf meant that every woman should keep their legs closed. That would disappoint many of us who are married.

Obviously he didn't mean every woman should keep her legs closed all the time, but I have a problem with anyone telling someone else--particularly someone who they have never met and don't really know--how or when or with whom, or how often they should be having sex.

Omaha Red Sox wrote:I do believe a promiscuous woman makes an unfit mother because she is not taking into account the well-being of her child.
And I don't. We're obviously not going to see eye-to-eye here. It takes many things to make an unfit mother, promiscuity may be a contributing factor, in many cases it most likely is, but I don't believe you can point to anyone and say "she has sex with multiple partners so she's a bad mother."

Omaha Red Sox wrote:Being promiscuous obviously puts you at risk of many things. Disease, emotional distress, violence, unwanted pregnancy, etc. Things that children should not have to deal with. Parents should not burden their kids with things such as these. On top of all this is the poor example given to these kids about relationships and marriage. Instability and hopelessness.


Being promiscuous doesn't put you at risk of those things in and of itself. Being a moron does. Anyone could be perfectly capable of having a different sex partner every week for a year without experiencing any of those things. On the other hand, someone could have a single sex partner for their entire life and experience them all.

Also, I disagree that it sends a bad message to kids about relationships or marriage. I think telling kids that they should only have one sex partner in their entire lives, and that they should not have sex until they are married is a worse message to send.
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Postby Art Vandelay » Thu Apr 12, 2007 11:22 am

knapplc wrote:
Art Vandelay wrote:I agree with more of what you said there than you might believe, but my problem is with saying she was an unfit mother or a bad person because she was promiscuous. If you want to say that her drug abuse ruined the child's life, or the fast company she chose to keep, then I most likely wouldn't argue. But when you say "she should have kept her legs closed" I have a problem with that.

I don’t get the angst over this phrase. Maybe it’s a regional thing, but where I grew up it was a phrase meaning that a girl sleeps around, usually denoting reckless promiscuity, and a question of ethics.

As far as I know, that's what it means everywhere. What I have a problem with is questioning someones ethics and judging them morally because of who they choose to have sex with. It implies that a woman shouldn't be sleeping with more people than whoever says it thinks is appropriate.
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Postby knapplc » Thu Apr 12, 2007 11:38 am

Art Vandelay wrote:
knapplc wrote:
Art Vandelay wrote:I agree with more of what you said there than you might believe, but my problem is with saying she was an unfit mother or a bad person because she was promiscuous. If you want to say that her drug abuse ruined the child's life, or the fast company she chose to keep, then I most likely wouldn't argue. But when you say "she should have kept her legs closed" I have a problem with that.

I don’t get the angst over this phrase. Maybe it’s a regional thing, but where I grew up it was a phrase meaning that a girl sleeps around, usually denoting reckless promiscuity, and a question of ethics.

As far as I know, that's what it means everywhere. What I have a problem with is questioning someones ethics and judging them morally because of who they choose to have sex with. It implies that a woman shouldn't be sleeping with more people than whoever says it thinks is appropriate.

You’re fighting a losing battle if you want to try to stop people from making judgments. You do it, I do it, everyone does it.
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Postby Art Vandelay » Thu Apr 12, 2007 11:54 am

knapplc wrote:You’re fighting a losing battle if you want to try to stop people from making judgments. You do it, I do it, everyone does it.

We've already been over this. I'm not trying to get people to stop making judgments, I'm trying to get them to start making the correct judgments...you know, the ones that I make.

I'm not saying people shouldn't judge others, I'm saying that they shouldn't judge others based on how many sexual partners they have. I find it ridiculous. It's puritanical, dogmatic, and arrogant to do so.
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Postby Omaha Red Sox » Thu Apr 12, 2007 12:04 pm

Art Vandelay wrote:
Omaha Red Sox wrote:Being promiscuous obviously puts you at risk of many things. Disease, emotional distress, violence, unwanted pregnancy, etc. Things that children should not have to deal with.


Being promiscuous doesn't put you at risk of those things in and of itself. Being a moron does. Anyone could be perfectly capable of having a different sex partner every week for a year without experiencing any of those things. On the other hand, someone could have a single sex partner for their entire life and experience them all.


Would you agree that the risk of disease, emotional instability, unwanted pregnancy, etc. is more common among those who are promiscuous than those who choose to have one partner? Children need stability. Do you disagree? And a parent who brings multiple partners around his/her children is irresponsible and unnecessary.

Art Vandelay wrote:
Omaha Red Sox wrote:Parents should not burden their kids with things such as these. On top of all this is the poor example given to these kids about relationships and marriage. Instability and hopelessness.
Also, I disagree that it sends a bad message to kids about relationships or marriage. I think telling kids that they should only have one sex partner in their entire lives, and that they should not have sex until they are married is a worse message to send.


Sexualizing a child is wrong. A kid should be able to be a kid with the less amount of drama as possible. As mentioned above, a parent who displays promiscuity for a child to witness (not the actual act of course) is sending a message detrimental to that child. A helpless attempt to find happiness, a hopelessness that comes from failed relationship after failed relationship, a message that it is ok to be used and walked upon. These characteristics are ones that no parent wants their child to have. But these traits are exactly what a child is exposed to and will emulate in the household of a promiscuous parent(s). We see evidence of this every day. Endless cycles.

How is suggesting to a child to wait till marriage to have sex and don't have multiple sexual relationships detrimental to this child? I understand that it is unreasonable to think all children will remain abstinent till they are married. It's unrealistic in this world we live in. But it is a quality message. It's healthy both emotionally and physically.
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Postby Nfl Fan » Thu Apr 12, 2007 12:05 pm

Art Vandelay wrote:
knapplc wrote:You’re fighting a losing battle if you want to try to stop people from making judgments. You do it, I do it, everyone does it.

We've already been over this. I'm not trying to get people to stop making judgments, I'm trying to get them to start making the correct judgments...you know, the ones that I make.

I'm not saying people shouldn't judge others, I'm saying that they shouldn't judge others based on how many sexual partners they have. I find it ridiculous. It's puritanical, dogmatic, and arrogant to do so.


DON'T JUDGE US FOR JUDGING THEM! :-b
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Postby knapplc » Thu Apr 12, 2007 12:09 pm

Art Vandelay wrote:
knapplc wrote:You’re fighting a losing battle if you want to try to stop people from making judgments. You do it, I do it, everyone does it.

We've already been over this. I'm not trying to get people to stop making judgments, I'm trying to get them to start making the correct judgments...you know, the ones that I make.

I'm not saying people shouldn't judge others, I'm saying that they shouldn't judge others based on how many sexual partners they have. I find it ridiculous. It's puritanical, dogmatic, and arrogant to do so.


No, it's practical. The more rampantly promiscuous women there are out there, the more likelihood there is of more and more welfare babies for our taxes to take care of. I don’t want to continue to support children that these women are indiscriminately having because they lack basic judgment skills. I am directly affected by their decision on how many sexual partners they have, and what level(s) of protection they choose or don’t choose to use. If I’m going to be asked to pay taxes to support them, I should have the ability to judge them.
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