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Of course Peyton then Vick right?

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Re: Of course Peyton then Vick right?

Postby eagles21 » Sat Jun 23, 2007 12:54 pm

Wow, I have nothing to add here. :-b

Great info from BOTH munboy and treat. From this, I can really understand how different Vick's fantasy numbers are compared to regular leagues and a QB run-heavy league. ;-D
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Re: Of course Peyton then Vick right?

Postby aaawall91 » Sat Jun 23, 2007 1:10 pm

Yeah, I would say the biggest factor in how Vick does this season won't be what your league scoring is but if he plays.
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Re: Of course Peyton then Vick right?

Postby Munboy » Sat Jun 23, 2007 2:05 pm

Good arguement Treat. I'm still not sold on Vick tho. Maybe with the scoring posted here, but there's been too many times I've looked at Vick's score after the games are over and almost every week I shake my head.

I'd say that Vick does have a couple things going for him this year. First is a new offense. Are they still in the WC under the new coach??? Vick sucked at the West Coast, plain and simple. The WC just doesn't suit his style of play. He's got a strong arm to get the ball down field, but his short passing is horribly inaccurate. Second is Joe Horn. Horn's got something Vick's been missing since he came into the league (not including TE)....sure hands. Horn's getting up there in age, but at least he can catch the ball. Third is Schaub is gone. There was calls for Schaub to be the QB, but now Vick doesn't have to worry about looking over his shoulder. They're def not going to yank him in favor of Joey the bouncing kangaroo.

All good things for Vick, but the two major things against Vick will keep me away from him. Injury risk and legal troubles. ;-D
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Re: Of course Peyton then Vick right?

Postby treat24 » Sat Jun 23, 2007 3:15 pm

Munboy wrote:Good arguement Treat. I'm still not sold on Vick tho. Maybe with the scoring posted here, but there's been too many times I've looked at Vick's score after the games are over and almost every week I shake my head.

I'd say that Vick does have a couple things going for him this year. First is a new offense. Are they still in the WC under the new coach??? Vick sucked at the West Coast, plain and simple. The WC just doesn't suit his style of play. He's got a strong arm to get the ball down field, but his short passing is horribly inaccurate. Second is Joe Horn. Horn's got something Vick's been missing since he came into the league (not including TE)....sure hands. Horn's getting up there in age, but at least he can catch the ball. Third is Schaub is gone. There was calls for Schaub to be the QB, but now Vick doesn't have to worry about looking over his shoulder. They're def not going to yank him in favor of Joey the bouncing kangaroo.

All good things for Vick, but the two major things against Vick will keep me away from him. Injury risk and legal troubles. ;-D


I agree with you, I am NOT sold on Vick... The main problem I've always had with Vick is he is different from year to year is that he is in a different offense and some years he's nice some years he is not. Last year was a boom year. This year may be a BUST year. You make an EXCELLENT point... without Shaub breathing down his neck... what is to stop him from being average and rushing less... You may end up being 100% correct on this. I didn't even thinnk of the Shaub/Joey factor, Great point. Vick changing offenses every year has killed his career cuz coaches want to change offenses... THEN they decide they want THAT offense AND Vick's rushing game. They don't coincide and Vick's fantasy potential suffers... I will also be avoiding Vick a little as my scoring is more standard...

By the way, I congratulated you in GT, but congratz on the 1k... and you are definitely an ASSET around here. Anyone who can make a good argument, do a little research, and help fantasy players out has my respect... and you do ;-D Here's to 1000 more... congratz man ;-D
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Re: Of course Peyton then Vick right?

Postby Nfl Fan » Sat Jun 23, 2007 4:07 pm

aaawall91 wrote:Yeah, I would say the biggest factor in how Vick does this season won't be what your league scoring is but if he plays.


Just what I'm thinking...
Seems there's a good chance of Joey putting up more points than Vick in Atlanta this year. :P
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Re: Of course Peyton then Vick right?

Postby onnestabe » Sat Jun 23, 2007 4:47 pm

Munboy wrote:Good arguement Treat. I'm still not sold on Vick tho. Maybe with the scoring posted here, but there's been too many times I've looked at Vick's score after the games are over and almost every week I shake my head.

I'd say that Vick does have a couple things going for him this year. First is a new offense. Are they still in the WC under the new coach??? Vick sucked at the West Coast, plain and simple. The WC just doesn't suit his style of play. He's got a strong arm to get the ball down field, but his short passing is horribly inaccurate. Second is Joe Horn. Horn's got something Vick's been missing since he came into the league (not including TE)....sure hands. Horn's getting up there in age, but at least he can catch the ball. Third is Schaub is gone. There was calls for Schaub to be the QB, but now Vick doesn't have to worry about looking over his shoulder. They're def not going to yank him in favor of Joey the bouncing kangaroo.

All good things for Vick, but the two major things against Vick will keep me away from him. Injury risk and legal troubles. ;-D


I believe the new offense is a power-run and downfield passing offense, so Vick will probably fit into that a little better than the West Coast Offense he has been in the past few years.

Joe Horn isn't going to do as much as you are giving him credit for. Horn's body has broken down and he can't stay healthy. He will be very good for Vick while he is on the field, but what happens when Horn pulls his hammy in practice in week 5 and then plays at 50% or not at all for the rest of the season? Then you have Jenkins, White, and the rookie Robinson dropping balls all over the field again.

Do you really think all of the sportswriters will shut up about Schaub just because he is in Houston now? There will still be articles and radio-show callers bashing Vick and saying "we should've traded Vick instead of Schaub." And just because Joey Harrington has struggled so far in his career, doesn't mean there won't be a group of fans calling for Joey over Vick - that happens to all but a handful of QBs in the league. They won't be calling for Joey because they want Joey as their QB. They will call for him because they don't want Vick. I'm not saying thay Vick needs to worry about Joey stealing his job - just that there will still be a lot of negative press towards Vick, and he hasn't really proven that he can ignore all that BS when he steps onto the field.

It's the same story as every other year for Vick - tons of fantasy potential due to his rushing, but a ton of issues (dog-fighting, fan relations, injury potential, new offense, few weapons around him, et cetera) he has to overcome to make that potential reality. I just don't think the odds of him overcoming all this stuff are very good this year.
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Re: Of course Peyton then Vick right?

Postby a4ce » Sat Jun 23, 2007 8:03 pm

Thanks guys for the great discussion. This scoring system really makes you think doesn't it. It's the "double-the-yardage-points-gotten-out-of-position" system. LOL RBs get 2pt/10yards RECEIVING and WRs get 2pts/10yards RUSHING. The rest is the same. We always laughed at the guy who drafted Vick "too early" but that same guy always went far. I personally would be hesistant making Vick the second QB off the board.

Great stuff there treat. When you broke it down like that it really screamed at me.

From our league, this is the top 5 at the end of the season:
1.Peyton
2.Vick
3.Brees
4.Brady
5.Palmer
Cash Money Brothers! - PPR
QB: Romo and Luck
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WR: AJ Green, Wayne, Bowe, Thompkins, and Gordon (IR)
TE: Witten
K: Prater
D/ST: 'Hawks
Start QB, 2RB, 2WR, TE, Flex, K and D/ST
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Re: Of course Peyton then Vick right?

Postby Munboy » Sat Jun 23, 2007 9:42 pm

treat24 wrote:
Munboy wrote:Good arguement Treat. I'm still not sold on Vick tho. Maybe with the scoring posted here, but there's been too many times I've looked at Vick's score after the games are over and almost every week I shake my head.

I'd say that Vick does have a couple things going for him this year. First is a new offense. Are they still in the WC under the new coach??? Vick sucked at the West Coast, plain and simple. The WC just doesn't suit his style of play. He's got a strong arm to get the ball down field, but his short passing is horribly inaccurate. Second is Joe Horn. Horn's got something Vick's been missing since he came into the league (not including TE)....sure hands. Horn's getting up there in age, but at least he can catch the ball. Third is Schaub is gone. There was calls for Schaub to be the QB, but now Vick doesn't have to worry about looking over his shoulder. They're def not going to yank him in favor of Joey the bouncing kangaroo.

All good things for Vick, but the two major things against Vick will keep me away from him. Injury risk and legal troubles. ;-D


I agree with you, I am NOT sold on Vick... The main problem I've always had with Vick is he is different from year to year is that he is in a different offense and some years he's nice some years he is not. Last year was a boom year. This year may be a BUST year. You make an EXCELLENT point... without Shaub breathing down his neck... what is to stop him from being average and rushing less... You may end up being 100% correct on this. I didn't even thinnk of the Shaub/Joey factor, Great point. Vick changing offenses every year has killed his career cuz coaches want to change offenses... THEN they decide they want THAT offense AND Vick's rushing game. They don't coincide and Vick's fantasy potential suffers... I will also be avoiding Vick a little as my scoring is more standard...

By the way, I congratulated you in GT, but congratz on the 1k... and you are definitely an ASSET around here. Anyone who can make a good argument, do a little research, and help fantasy players out has my respect... and you do ;-D Here's to 1000 more... congratz man ;-D



Whoa, i didn't even realize i hit the 1k mark (again). Thanks! ;-D
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Re: Of course Peyton then Vick right?

Postby Dawinner127 » Sun Jun 24, 2007 5:11 pm

Wow. This might have been one of the best arguments I have ever read on this forum (not saying much since I haven't even been here for a year, but WOW!!). I have a headache now from all these facts and numbers.

Great posts with tons of information that sure as heck helped me out ;-D
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Re: Of course Peyton then Vick right?

Postby Munboy » Sun Jun 24, 2007 10:30 pm

Dawinner127 wrote:Wow. This might have been one of the best arguments I have ever read on this forum (not saying much since I haven't even been here for a year, but WOW!!). I have a headache now from all these facts and numbers.

Great posts with tons of information that sure as heck helped me out ;-D



Yea, Treat made a good agruement. Vick's numbers are seemingly there, but all I can remember when I think about Vick was the weeks I laughed at his pathetic numbers last year...and the year before....and the year before. When you couple that with the possiblity of legal issues, I won't go near him. If this whole dog thing goes through, there's no telling if he'll get a free pass until the end of the year (like Jamal Lewis did a few years ago). There are other QBs out there who will score me an average amount of points week in and week out that I will target instead.
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