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Sanders: Overrated? article

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Re: Sanders: Overrated? article

Postby scrumtalecent » Tue Oct 23, 2007 12:04 pm

Cornbread Maxwell wrote:I want to preface this by stating that I will always be a little mad at Barry because of the way he QUIT. I have the utmost admoration for him as a player, but quite a lot less as a person because of that one selfish act. The organization was set back years because of it.


I'll never agree with anyone that calls Barry a quitter. The average career of a RB is five years. Barry gave us TEN. Barry gave 10 years of his blood, sweat and tears to a team that rewarded him with nothing. He didn't want to be stuck on a mediocre team. He wanted to WIN, and that wasn't happening here. We don't know what happened behind the scenes and we never will. People want to say that this quiet man who never got in trouble, and always just handed the ball off to the ref purposely stuck it to this team?? No way. Something happened, or just 10 years of mediocrity happened, and he couldn't take it anymore. Anyone who gave to the city (or at least Lion fans) what he did is allowed to leave on his own terms, not what everyone else thinks they're entitled to.
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Re: Sanders: Overrated? article

Postby Cornbread Maxwell » Tue Oct 23, 2007 6:59 pm

scrumtalecent wrote:
Cornbread Maxwell wrote:I want to preface this by stating that I will always be a little mad at Barry because of the way he QUIT. I have the utmost admoration for him as a player, but quite a lot less as a person because of that one selfish act. The organization was set back years because of it.


I'll never agree with anyone that calls Barry a quitter. The average career of a RB is five years. Barry gave us TEN. Barry gave 10 years of his blood, sweat and tears to a team that rewarded him with nothing. He didn't want to be stuck on a mediocre team. He wanted to WIN, and that wasn't happening here. We don't know what happened behind the scenes and we never will. People want to say that this quiet man who never got in trouble, and always just handed the ball off to the ref purposely stuck it to this team?? No way. Something happened, or just 10 years of mediocrity happened, and he couldn't take it anymore. Anyone who gave to the city (or at least Lion fans) what he did is allowed to leave on his own terms, not what everyone else thinks they're entitled to.


It was the timing of it. He has the right to walk away whenever he felt like it - as does anyone. Right isnt the issue. Had he said "this will be my last yr", I would have been fine with that, but he didnt - he walked away just a few months before the season began - not nearly enough time to recover for the team. This isnt an issue of entitlement or rights - its an issue of team morals: whats best for the organization and the fans. And yes, when you drop a bomb the way he did on this city, it can absolutely be considered quitting - he didnt warn the fans or the team whatsoever. Maybe there was somthing that happened behind the scenes - so what? Id still consider it quitting. Maybe I do feel I'm entitled to a better ending from one of the best all time, because the way it did end was a very bitter one - he basically said "I dont care about this team or the fans, Im gonna do whats right for me" - and for that, as a fan he just flipped off, I have every right to call him a quitter.
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Re: Sanders: Overrated? article

Postby Jimboozie » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:25 pm

Did you guys even read the article? He was calling out Barry Sanders for not showing up in the big games...the playoffs!

If I was starting a team from scratch, I'd probably take Deion Sanders over Barry (if they were both rookies) but it is really close. I'm not doubting Barry's talent, more so giving props to Deion. He was the only player I've ever seen that truly deserves the title "shutdown corner". Add in the fact that he was like Devin Hester in the return game and averaged 25 yards per INT return, and I think he's worthy of taking over any RB in NFL history.

Flame on.

BTW, I was at the Lions game on Sunday by the endzone where Garcia fumbled at the one! Some tool behind us was wearing an Alstott jersey. Amid all the noise, I think I did hear a quiver when Detroit recovered that fumble. :-D
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Re: Sanders: Overrated? article

Postby Cornbread Maxwell » Tue Oct 23, 2007 9:31 pm

Jimboozie wrote:Did you guys even read the article? He was calling out Barry Sanders for not showing up in the big games...the playoffs!


Did you read it? His entire premise - that Barry is overrated because he benefited greatly from his situation - is completely laughable. It's utterly ridiculous. Anyone that watched the Lions during the Barry years knows he was hindered by those around him - not helped. He throws up playoff stats as proof - are you kidding me? You should know stats dont tell why something happened the way it did. YPC doesnt tell you how good the Oline is, if the QB and WRs have done enough to get the D off the LOS, or if the team was actually in a position to run effectively. Using YPC or any other stat without taking a close look at situation first is a joke. Detroit never had the talent to go far in the playoffs with Barry - so now Barry is overrated because of it? Give me a break.

As for your belief that you would take Deion over Barry if you were starting a team, I guess I wouldnt be able to disagree too much. Deion really is the only true shutown CB I have ever seen play. Some CBs are very good and do a good job of hindering the WR, but no one could completely take away a player or area the way Deion did. Add in the ST stuff and he was one of the biggest and most unique difference makers the NFL has ever seen. I guess I would take Deion over Barry as well.
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Re: Sanders: Overrated? article

Postby stomperrob » Wed Oct 24, 2007 1:01 am

Other than my numerous Steelers' jerseys, the only other jersey I ever wear is my Barry Sanders jersey. People always love tearing down the great ones - it's how little men make themselves feel big or try to get noticed.

Whenever people criticize Barry, I always like to quote someone who knew a thing or two about the running game, instead of listening to some pencil-necked geek trying to rewrite history. To sum it up briefly, he describes Barry thusly:
"His ability to stop, restart, and change direction, all within a five-yard radius, is better than anybody I ever saw. His hips were amazing. It looked like he almost could turn them completely around his back. And he had great balance, great leg strength and great speed. He was fast. Some people underestimate his speed, saying he was more quick then fast."
"I can't think of any runner who compares to him. People often bring up Gale Sayers, but I've watched Sayers and he didn't do any of the things that you see Barry do. Sayers had speed and agility, no question, but he never did the things that Barry did every time you watched him. I've never seen anybody who had the abilities Barry possessed."
"One of those abilities, and one you don't hear a lot of people talk about, was his ability to avoid the big hit. Guys couldn't get a good hit on him, which was important, because that kept him healthy and in the game. Some people criticized him, saying he was flashy but that too many times he'd lose two or three yards because of his running style. But he never had an All-Pro offensive line in front of him, opening up holes. He lost yards sometimes because he was too busy trying to make 5 guys miss!"


The author - none other than Emmitt Smith!

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Last edited by stomperrob on Wed Oct 24, 2007 1:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Sanders: Overrated? article

Postby stomperrob » Wed Oct 24, 2007 1:18 am

scrumtalecent wrote:
Cornbread Maxwell wrote:I want to preface this by stating that I will always be a little mad at Barry because of the way he QUIT. I have the utmost admoration for him as a player, but quite a lot less as a person because of that one selfish act. The organization was set back years because of it.


I'll never agree with anyone that calls Barry a quitter. The average career of a RB is five years. Barry gave us TEN. Barry gave 10 years of his blood, sweat and tears to a team that rewarded him with nothing. He didn't want to be stuck on a mediocre team. He wanted to WIN, and that wasn't happening here. We don't know what happened behind the scenes and we never will. People want to say that this quiet man who never got in trouble, and always just handed the ball off to the ref purposely stuck it to this team?? No way. Something happened, or just 10 years of mediocrity happened, and he couldn't take it anymore. Anyone who gave to the city (or at least Lion fans) what he did is allowed to leave on his own terms, not what everyone else thinks they're entitled to.


Actually if you read his book he does explain some of his reasons for leaving and I can't say as I blame him, much as I wish he would have stayed, both so I could have watched him more, and so he could have gotten the rushing record instead of Emmitt (as an interesting aside, Terrell Davis mentioned on TV recently that he felt if Barry kept playing, he would have obliterated the record and he would have had the all-time record to himself).

Basically Barry's complaint was that he was upset when the Lions started letting some of their better players go (like Bennie Blades, Lomas Brown, Kevin Glover) - he decided that was evidence that the Lions' goal wasn't winning games. He felt management had destroyed the locker room chemistry. He was upset that the organization was not as committed to winning as he was, especially because of all he did in the off season to prepare himself. He decided he was burned out, that he didn't enjoy it anymore and that he didn't need it anymore and so he walked away from it. In Barry's mind, it was the team (management) that had quit!

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Re: Sanders: Overrated? article

Postby latsprewell20002000 » Sat Nov 17, 2007 7:10 pm

Thats funny that if you were starting a team from scratch you would take Deion over Barry lol. I mean cmon man. Arguably the best RB to play the game or a DB?? I mean its not even close. The way Barry quit sucked and he meant it to suck. When your team is lucky enough to have someoen like this come along you drop everything you are doing and you win championships. Just like all the other greats. You get some people around him and you win. The lions filled the stands for years on Barry alone and were fine with letting it stay like that. Well he wasnt. So fine F*ck you I quit.
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Re: Sanders: Overrated? article

Postby scrumtalecent » Sat Nov 17, 2007 7:21 pm

latsprewell20002000 wrote:. When your team is lucky enough to have someoen like this come along you drop everything you are doing and you win championships. Just like all the other greats. You get some people around him and you win. The lions filled the stands for years on Barry alone and were fine with letting it stay like that. Well he wasnt. So fine F*ck you I quit.



That's probably the most well put answer to the Barry predicament I've ever read. That's exactly it. They were fine with just having the fans come watch Barry which is why I went every year. That's the problem with Ford. As long as the seats are filled he could care less how Millen is running the team. He does not want to look like he was wrong so he gives him another 5 years to screw up the team even more. If he would ever realize how much more money he could make with a very good football team, maybe we would finally make better trades than dre bly for tatum bell/george foster and Dre wouldn't have hated this team to begin with.
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Re: Sanders: Overrated? article

Postby moochman » Sun Nov 18, 2007 11:44 am

scrumtalecent wrote:
latsprewell20002000 wrote:. When your team is lucky enough to have someoen like this come along you drop everything you are doing and you win championships. Just like all the other greats. You get some people around him and you win. The lions filled the stands for years on Barry alone and were fine with letting it stay like that. Well he wasnt. So fine F*ck you I quit.



That's probably the most well put answer to the Barry predicament I've ever read. That's exactly it. They were fine with just having the fans come watch Barry which is why I went every year. That's the problem with Ford. As long as the seats are filled he could care less how Millen is running the team. He does not want to look like he was wrong so he gives him another 5 years to screw up the team even more. If he would ever realize how much more money he could make with a very good football team, maybe we would finally make better trades than dre bly for tatum bell/george foster and Dre wouldn't have hated this team to begin with.


Money means even less to William Clay Ford than the fans do. If the idiot had any idea about money the Ford family wouldn't have kept him out of the car business. And if he had any idea how fans feel he would give a king's ransom to every incompetent he finds that will work for him: Russ Thomas, Captn' Wayno, Door-Matt Millen. He no more cares about the team making more money, and remember an NFL franchise is liscence to print money, than he does whether the team wins or loses.

And anyone who would take any other player over Sanders to start a franchise speaks a different football language than I.
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Re: Sanders: Overrated? article

Postby latsprewell20002000 » Sun Nov 18, 2007 8:23 pm

Yeah to say you would take Deion is just simply sickening.
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