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GC: Redskins vs Patriots [Week 8]

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Re: GC: Redskins vs Patriots [Week 8]

Postby Cowboys 4 life » Sun Oct 28, 2007 10:33 pm

portisfan24 wrote:Wow, there is so much ignorance in this thread that I could make this post 10, 000 words long, but I'll hold back.

1) All this talk about other teams thinking the Pats have no class for running up the score, has anyone actually seen another player say that? I know they have been called classless for the videotaping and thats a whole other story, but when has anyone said "oh look at the Patritos scorin gall those points, how classless?"

2) When was the last time a team pulled their starters before the 4th quarter? I haven't seen a single team pull anyone in the third quarter in recent memory. But of course the big bad Patriots should because they are just big jerks.

3) The "the game was over" argument is also pretty stupid. If that is the case Washington should be pulling their starters as well, if the game is over. They are risking injury as well are they not?

4) The fouth down play. I didn't see the game but I'll assume it was 4th and short. Has anyone thought that maybe its just good to practice that kind of play in a game situation, against the leagues previously 5th ranked defense?

5) Whoever said they were putting an asterisk next to the TD record if Brady gets it is totally clueless. Didn't Brady rush for 2 TD's today? I'm sure if he cared about the record that much he wouldn't be running it into the endzone at all. And if I recall when Manning broke the record there was a lot of griping about how many TD passes he threw from the 1 yard line, so apparently with great success comes a band of morons bashing them.

6) "They should run the ball at the end of the game" Why? You run the ball to eat up clock and close out the game. Isn't scoring a much easier way to win the game? The Pats gameplan is to throw the ball, why change the gameplan? And don't give me the whole have respect for our opponent crap. These are grown men who have all been on both sides of a game like this many times, I am sure they can handle it. If they don't like it there is a pretty easy solution: stop them!


So in conclusion, please stop crying about the Patriots scoring a lot of points. It is getting tiresome and frankly it just makes you look like a total whiner.


Great post PF.

I agree completely.

The Pats are the best team in football right now. As a team they can break a lot of NFL records this season. Personal and team records including most points scored by a team, most TD's thrown by a QB, most TD's caught by a WR, etc, etc..

I didn't agree with the Pats video taping but I kind of think this is their way of saying screw everyone. This team is absolutely amazing. I haven't ever seen such a dominating team in the 25 years I have been watching.
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Re: GC: Redskins vs Patriots [Week 8]

Postby JasonSeahorn » Sun Oct 28, 2007 10:43 pm

like i posted in another thread, the main reason i don't like seeing brady still going all out near the end of games like this are because of freak injuries. cassell freaking sucks, if anything ever happened to brady i'd be really worried as a patriots fan.
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Re: GC: Redskins vs Patriots [Week 8]

Postby FalconFL » Sun Oct 28, 2007 10:50 pm

portisfan24 wrote:2) When was the last time a team pulled their starters before the 4th quarter? I haven't seen a single team pull anyone in the third quarter in recent memory. But of course the big bad Patriots should because they are just big jerks.


Week 5: San Diego vs Denver. Up 34-3 in the 3rd quarter. LT pulled for Turner. Turner becomes the NFL's week leading rusher in one quarter, almost loses me the week.

I don't really care about running up the score, but you RISK INJURY. So do what you want to do, but don't complain when someone gets hurt when it could have been avoided.
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Re: GC: Redskins vs Patriots [Week 8]

Postby zevon » Sun Oct 28, 2007 10:53 pm

Cowboys 4 life wrote:Great post PF.

I agree completely.

The Pats are the best team in football right now. As a team they can break a lot of NFL records this season. Personal and team records including most points scored by a team, most TD's thrown by a QB, most TD's caught by a WR, etc, etc..

I didn't agree with the Pats video taping but I kind of think this is their way of saying screw everyone. This team is absolutely amazing. I haven't ever seen such a dominating team in the 25 years I have been watching.


I've been watching for almost 40 and the only one that comes to mind is the 86 Bears. The 72 Fish set the gold standard, but they didn't blow people out the way N.E. is.
The possibility of seeing some records fall and / or going undefeated is exciting to me as both a Pats and football fan. I was pulling for the Colts to do it a couple years ago, of course I wouldn't have wanted them to do it against the Pats in the playoffs nor do I want them to continue their current streak next week
Good post yourself, as a Boys fan with high expectations I'm sure you weren't happy about getting blown out. Thanks for recognizing it's a case of being beaten by a currently better team, and giving the Pats props.
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Re: GC: Redskins vs Patriots [Week 8]

Postby zevon » Sun Oct 28, 2007 11:01 pm

FalconFL wrote:
portisfan24 wrote:2) When was the last time a team pulled their starters before the 4th quarter? I haven't seen a single team pull anyone in the third quarter in recent memory. But of course the big bad Patriots should because they are just big jerks.


Week 5: San Diego vs Denver. Up 34-3 in the 3rd quarter. LT pulled for Turner. Turner becomes the NFL's week leading rusher in one quarter, almost loses me the week.

I don't really care about running up the score, but you RISK INJURY. So do what you want to do, but don't complain when someone gets hurt when it could have been avoided.


I do agree on the risking injury point, but fact is it hasn't happened , and yes, I'll say yet.
If someone gets hurt on a freak play or on a vicious tackle, well, that's football and it happens.
The prevailing wisdom by some here is that the Pats are asking for it and if someone gets taken out by whatever means they deserve it. That's the part I disagree with. Yeah, they have run up the score. I don't see a bunch of taunting going on as they're doing it.
Does that make it OK?
I don't have a problem with it in the first place, so FOR ME, I'd say yeah.
Got a World Series to win.
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Re: GC: Redskins vs Patriots [Week 8]

Postby Melo255 » Mon Oct 29, 2007 10:52 am

I'm a lurker over here on the football side as opposed to an involved member on the baseball side but this discussion is forcing me to post here.

I keep hearing people say the Patriots should run out the clock for pretty much the entire fourth quarter. The usual reason is 'oh what if one of the Patriots starters get hurt? then they're gonna be so sorry.' That's shortsighted and really kind of ignorant as it means you are not taking into account the Patriots personnel. Who are they going to rush with these 30 times for the 4th quarters of these games? Laurance Maroney is still working himself back from an injury, Sammy Morris is out for the next few weeks at least and Kevin Faulk is a 3rd down/receiving back. Clearly the Patriots believe the chances that a RB coming back from an injury who would get drilled every time he rushes the ball is far likelier to get hurt than a QB behind an all world offensive line and receivers who outrun everybody. It's not like the Pats are going to run Faulk and Eckel for the whole 4th quarter and just keep giving the ball over to the other team after they go 3 and out every time. If the Patriots have a key starter injured in a game then they will deal with it the same way their fan base will. To constantly criticize the Pats and their fans for what 'might' happen to a starter is ridiculous.

Also, Brady came out of the game with about 8 minutes remaining and the backup scored on a 15 yard scramble. Eventually they even brought in the 3rd string QB. Brady wasn't on the field with a minute left here people. This game was a tune up for the showdown with Indy and I have absolutely no problem with Brady, Moss and company getting as much time to try and perfect everything they could against the 5th ranked defense coming in. It seems like most people want Brady to play for the first half or only 3 quarters and skip the 4th every week.

What especially gets me is people talk about the game against Miami like it was some kind of sin. The Pats were winning 42-7 at halftime and only scored 7 points in the second half. Brady was sitting out in the 4th and then came back in only when the lead dropped to 21 points and momentum was swinging in the other direction. I've noticed over the past few weeks that nobody has mentioned that the Colts won their game that week BY MORE THAN THE PATRIOTS DID!

The fact is that Dallas, Miami and Washington all kept their own starters in late in the game and they certainly never let up with trying to score. Are the Patriots supposed to bench all of their starters and let the other team get second half garbage stats - like Miami did until they started getting too close for Bellicheck's comfort - just so the final score isn't damaging to their apparently oh so fragile mental health?

I agree totally with what Bellicheck said last week ""I've been coaching too long," Belichick said. "I remember being on that side. When I was coaching defense it was my job to keep the score down, not theirs. When you're playing defense it's your job to stop them. It's not (the offense's) job to not score. It's like I tell the offense, what the (bleep) do you think I send you guys out there for? To punt? We have a punt team for that. That's not your job. Your job is to go out there and score points. If you come off the field and you haven't scored points you haven't done your job."

It's embarrassing to hear so many people whine about stuff like this. All teams have the same resources. The Redskins were supposed to be a great defensive unit. Their coach is a hall of famer who's had four years to get the players he's wanted. If a team like that can't stop another team from scoring you shouldn't be complaining about it. The players should be learning from it and working their butt of the rest of the season to improve while NFL fans should be applauding the Patriots for playing hard all game and giving it their all.
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Re: GC: Redskins vs Patriots [Week 8]

Postby Patchell » Mon Oct 29, 2007 12:21 pm

I don't agree with Don Cherry much, and I know this issue is about football not hockey, but basically the same issue.

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Re: GC: Redskins vs Patriots [Week 8]

Postby Mysteryhunter » Tue Oct 30, 2007 2:17 am

ok so if next week colts are up 38-0 and herm goes for it on a 4th down will bill and pats fans be ok with it?

if herm went for it on a 4th down up 38-0 with a qb sneak i know for a fact colts fans would not be ok with that. why risk your season (cause that what brady is for the pats) on meaningless football?

did the pats play their starters every down of the preseason? if so then i have no problem with what im seeing here, its just pats football. if not...then i wonder why they are playing them now.
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Re: GC: Redskins vs Patriots [Week 8]

Postby Brillonius » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:23 pm

Been a Pats fan as long as I can remember, therefore I am admittedly biased. So...

Bill Belichick is a complete ass. IMO he is a miserable human being who just happens to be an outstanding football coach. He is most definitely not a "people person". That said, there are 30 other cities in the league who'd murder their head coaches in their sleep if it meant he would take over their team (the only exception, I believe, would be Indy). And almost every fan in those cities would make the same "excuses" for him that NE fans do. Why? Well, the most honest answer is because he wins games. I was going to write something about "standing up for your own", but the truth is, if he were a losing coach he'd have been out the door. He's a winner and people love winners (except the ones losing at his expense, which is just about everyone these days...)

People can bitch and moan about "Cameragate" all they want, and it will only fuel the fire. Can't you see it's exactly what Belichick wants? Before this season everyone was talking about how great the Pats are, how they are role models, how they are the shining standard to which the rest of the league should aspire. Pretty heady stuff, easy for players to lose their edge. How does Belichick keep them motivated? How does he take the new "America's Team" and convince them that it's still "us vs. the world, boys!"? "Cameragate" was exactly what Bill needed to take an already excellent team and make them scary, scary good. Hell, if I didn't know better I'd say Mangini was sent to NY on the Patriots behalf. Look what he's done for them, and look what he's done for the Jets...We all know Belichick is just crazy enough to have thought of it.

I have no problems with the players on the field though. No self-respecting player pulls himself out of the game. They play until they are told not to play. They make the plays their coaches tell them to make. If the other team can't stop them...well, that's too damn bad. Wash supposedly had the #5 DEF in the league, and they lose 52-7? NE shouldn't be the ones ashamed of what they did on the field, and I doubt they are.

Karma is a bitch, and Bill will get his sooner or later, but to play that card you gotta be able to deal...and I don't see anyone this season who can.
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Re: GC: Redskins vs Patriots [Week 8]

Postby zevon » Wed Oct 31, 2007 7:32 am

Nice first post, Brillonius.
Belichick is an ass, but he's "our" ass and you're probably right that Indy is the only team that probably wouldn't hire him tomorrow. When he left the Jets, his speech was so rambling garbled that he actually sounded retarded. I wasn't jumping for joy that this was the guy who was going to be running the Pats. He has proved to everyone that he is a great motivator, whether we agree with his tactics or not, and a genius game planner. Notice I don't say "fine upstanding wonderful personality human being". He expects perfection from his players and hates to lose - see Vince Lombardi.
Yeah, I wish he was more personable like that other great coach named Bill, Mr Walsh, but he is what he is.
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