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William Clay Calling the shots now?

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William Clay Calling the shots now?

Postby moochman » Fri Nov 23, 2007 12:16 pm

According to the Detnews Rod Parker: "Lions owner William Clay Ford instructed the coaching staff this past week to throw more to Johnson, a source told The Detroit News. Lions officials Thursday would not confirm or deny that the coaches were asked to get the ball to Johnson, the second overall pick in April's NFL draft, though it was clear he was more involved than he had been in any other game this season." http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071123/OPINION03/711230386/1343/OPINION0307

Should this be true, what does it mean? Well, for one thing it means that Martz is gone. There is no way an arrogant man like Martz will stand for that kind of interference. The fact that he still wants a job in the league is probably the main reason that he didn't resign on the spot. I wonder how long word has been leaking down from the throne of WCF to Martz before a directive was issued? Could explain some of the rumors that the Lions aren't happy with Martz and his stalled air show.

It would also help explain the weird draft. Picking Johnson was a no-brainer, but what of Drew Staton? I recall reading of how the first thing they did was to change the way Drew threw. Now we know Martz can take an Arena league grocery bagger and turn him into a good QB, so why would he ever take a QB high in a draft? Methinks he didn't. I think that pick was another WCF directive. Draft the local kid that people will all love because, well, because he's local. And could have the rest of the draft, all those reaches...er...projects been a directive as well. Something along the lines of "We spent big bucks on Calvin, Redding, and White now you fill out your draft with players who will sign inexpensive contracts.

It also means that Rod will be disingenuous or blindly naive when he is asked about it and denies any influence from WCF. Worse yet he will be puppetized should he acknowledge that it happened.

It also means the Lions FO, and WCf are very thin skinned. All the press the last couple games has gone on about the lack of commitment to the run game and that we don't use CJ2. So what happens? We run a lot and pass to CJ2 alot. As long as the focus is on what the public opinion is instead of what we can do to improve the Lions will continue to losingly stumble through a league that has never been so devoid of quality teams. The playoffs are there to be had and the Lions FO is concerned with the press. Bad seed, bad flower.

I loved this quote from the ultimate company shill, Kitna: "Kitna said there hasn't been a philosophy change in the Lions' offense.

"We liked our matchup with him on their second or third corner," Kitna said. "But their second and third corner played good. They made plays and we just didn't."
Ah, I see. As opposed to all the first CB coverage CJ2 had been getting all season?

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Re: William Clay Calling the shots now?

Postby latsprewell20002000 » Fri Nov 23, 2007 2:30 pm

Yeah ive been listening and reading all this stuff so far this morning lol. I think it does mean that Martz is gone. So what does that leave us with. Marinelli? I have to think that hes gone too possibly. Maybe not, im not sure. I heard on the radio this morning( im saying this cause some people jump on my balls when i say things that i heard on the radio here) that they are saying that we say Marinellis apex at 6-2. That 6-2 is going to be remembered as Marinellis best accomplishment. I wonder what happens in 2008 when KJ and Roy are unrestricted. Cant keep both. Slap franchise on KJ? Hmm not sure. The lions are convinced that they can do all the work through free agency instead of drafting good. We had 3 second round picks and two of them arent even playing this year. Its all about the starters you get from rounds 4-6. I think WCF is listening to sports radio or reading the paper or something. The really sad thing is the way that Calvin played. You cant chauk not catching the ball to being a rookie mistake. Kitna is not the QB for this Martz offense. First you need to be able to throw the ball far. He cant, atleast not accurately. Second the O line cant hold anyone long enough for them to get downfield. Within the first 2 seconds of the snap Kitna has someone closing in on him and usually its coming from his right. God this sucks.
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Re: William Clay Calling the shots now?

Postby moochman » Sat Nov 24, 2007 11:35 am

First off, Spree, always remember that sportstalk radio is for entertainment purposes only :-b What I mean is that there is a tendancy on a medium that relies on its listeners for its success to formulate subject matter to incite listeners to call in. That is why you are hearing the talk of Marinelli being on thin ice.
I don't think for a minute that his job is in jeopardy. His has done a very good job at getting the team to think as one. There are some exceptions, Shaun Rogers most notably. I expect the Lions to try and rid themselves of their best D player if he doesn't finish strong. I would like to see him fired maybe afternext season. Rod looks more like a bridge than an answer. He has helped clean out the trash in the lockerroom but he looks real flawed on gameday and is too inconsistant in his philosophies to be a head coach. And now if it is so that WCF handed down an edict to play CJ2, Rod will not have the respect a head coach has to have to make players respect decisions.
Martz contract expires at the end of the year, methinks, and I'm pretty sure that he will not be asked to stick around. Nor would he want to.

Kitna has looked terrible lately and if we've seen the apex of anything, it is the apex Kitna's career. I doubt we will ever see any better QB play from him than we've already seen. He just wasn't blessed with a strong enough arm, decisive and sound football mind, or a good enough team to be an upper tier QB. I think the number 8 may represent his win potential regardless of the team that surrounds him. In Cincy an inexperienced Palmer was far more successful than a savy Kitna. That's telling.

Don't know what to think of Cal 'Drops' Johnson. That was very disturbing to see him highlighted and not make the plays elite WRs should make more often. And to see that even when he made the catches he never looked as if he were a threat to take it to the house. Is this guy turning into a better Mike WIlliams? I know that is harsh, but a lot was expected from Drops.
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Re: William Clay Calling the shots now?

Postby latsprewell20002000 » Sat Nov 24, 2007 12:08 pm

Yeah i know about the radio crap and id say more than half of it is just them trying to get people fired up and get good conversations going. I dont agree with most of it but some of it has some merit. Its not like everything i type here is something i hear on the damn radio lol. Marinelli does seem more like a bridge but what comes after the bridge? I mean everyone agrees that Martz is probably not going to be here next year no matter what happens. Does that mean that the team has to learn a whole new playbook and offense?? If thats the case that sorta sucks. I dont think that Marinellis job is on the line at all. I mean look at what Millen has gotten away with. It doesnt really matter how good you are at your job here but rather if he likes you or not. All this stuff that comes out of Coach M is toughness, tackling and grit. I dont understand that. They cant tackle anyone, and their best defensive player comes out of the game every other play. Rogers comes out way too much. His contract balloons pretty big after this year i think and that could get him out of here. IF they are constantly double teaming him then why cant someone else get through the line?? Why dont we bump the WRs?? EVER. We just allow them to run the route they want to while running along side of them. Kitna yeah hes a backup and had some shining moments this season early on and yes that was his apex no doubt lol. His arm is weak and hes inaccurate. Calvin I think hes going to be fine. He had a bad game on thursday no doubt about that. But there were some plays that he could have made if Kitna throws the ball basically anywhere but where he throws it that he catches them. The one across the middle that hit him in the numbers, well yeah that cant happen. It does happen though when you look up thinking that you have a chance to take it to the house. Comparing Calvin to Mike is unfair I think.
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Re: William Clay Calling the shots now?

Postby dream_017 » Sat Nov 24, 2007 9:53 pm

Answer: Kitna




Question: What is the main reason for the Lions recent losses?


moochman wrote:Don't know what to think of Cal 'Drops' Johnson. That was very disturbing to see him highlighted and not make the plays elite WRs should make more often. And to see that even when he made the catches he never looked as if he were a threat to take it to the house. Is this guy turning into a better Mike WIlliams? I know that is harsh, but a lot was expected from Drops.

mooch, I wouldn't worry too much about CJ2. As much as I was a Joey supporter, saying that if he had some time that he could make some plays and the WRs were never open....it is the complete opposite now. Sure Kitna is being rushed, but he has had time in the pocket, but made poor decisions and has not made acurate throws. The WRs are open, but the ball is thrown behind them or just floating to them. There is no crispness to his passes. At least 2 of the drops by CJ2 were because the ball just floated to him. So not only does he habe to slow down his route to get where the pass is ending up, but the ball is going in slow motion getting to him. It must look like a knuckleball to him.

I know I read a quote or article about it somewhere, and not sure what was shown on TV, but Roy was PISSED at least 3 time coming off the field. They were not even looking his way and he glared at Martz and very animated coming off the field. This can not be good for the Lions short or long term.

The defense put ZERO pressure on Favre. Very surprised that we could cause more mistakes than we did from him.

Poor coaching decision in my opinion - we are down 22 - we need 3 TDs and 1 needs to have a 2 pt conversion. We score the 1st TD, I understand and agree that it is still too early to go for 2, but there was a defensive penalty on the extra point. Still OK with taking the PAT. Then we score again and again the Packer had a penalty on the extra point. You still need the 2 pt conversion and you would get the ball at the 1....how many time are there going to be a penalty on the extra point. I think they should have gone for 2 at that time...especially as bad as they are in short yardage situations, 1 yard can help them...OK maybe not.

If only -- If only the Lions can put the ball in the endzone. This is a different game and maybe another Denver blowout. Instead we are only up 6 and the first sustained drive by the Packers put them up 7-6. At that point we had a 13-4 minute advantage on the clock. 120-30 total yard advantage. 5-1 first down advantage. Took the wind right out of the stadium.

Thats it for mow, just very fustrated with the whole game :-t
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Re: William Clay Calling the shots now?

Postby latsprewell20002000 » Sun Nov 25, 2007 12:29 am

how many time are there going to be a penalty on the extra point. I think they should have gone for 2 at that time...especially as bad as they are in short yardage situations, 1 yard can help them...OK maybe not.


I was thinking the same exact thing when that happened. No matter what happened they were going to need a 2 point conversion IF they could hold GB to no more scores. So why would you not try it then?? Oh wait I know. They never thought it would matter cause they didnt look that far ahead cause they knew they could stop GB from scoring. We made Favre look so good that day it was sick.

I wouldnt say that i was a Harrington supporter but i would say the same thing to people about him having a good arm and if he had time he would be able to hit the guys. Im not sure if we will ever really find out the truth cause hes in a terrible position now. How many wins in a row did he have when he got pulled for Leftwich?? Was it two or three?? Anyways that was BS for them to pull him when he got the team winning. Oh well. I agree with you on the CJ stuff. Hes gonna be fine. We just need someone that can freaking throw the ball and make it look like it was thrown by a professional.
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Re: William Clay Calling the shots now?

Postby moochman » Mon Nov 26, 2007 12:09 pm

You can't go for two there. If you don't make it then you have to score twice more, if you kick the PAT you need only score once more. The way it changes the flow of the game would virtually concede the win to the other team.
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Re: William Clay Calling the shots now?

Postby moochman » Mon Nov 26, 2007 12:16 pm

dream_017 wrote:Answer: Kitna




Question: What is the main reason for the Lions recent losses?

Sure Kitna is being rushed, but he has had time in the pocket, but made poor decisions and has not made acurate throws. The WRs are open, but the ball is thrown behind them or just floating to them. There is no crispness to his passes. At least 2 of the drops by CJ2 were because the ball just floated to him. So not only does he habe to slow down his route to get where the pass is ending up, but the ball is going in slow motion getting to him. It must look like a knuckleball to him.

I know I read a quote or article about it somewhere, and not sure what was shown on TV, but Roy was PISSED at least 3 time coming off the field. They were not even looking his way and he glared at Martz and very animated coming off the field. This can not be good for the Lions short or long term.


I think we are seeing firsthand what the Bengals saw prior to handing the keys to Palmer-Kitna lacks the tools to be a winning QB. Sadly we have oft-injured and unproved Drew Stanton to hand the keys to which all but gaurantees we have Kitna starting again next year. And without Martz to design plays that could even make Kitna look servicable.
As for Roy, if Martz doesn't leave (and he almost surely will) Roy will probably ask for way too much money on his next contract so he can get out of here.

The Lions could be right back to the square none we've been stuck at since M&M has been the figurehead of the franchise. As a candy it melts in your mouth, but as a president and GM it melts on the field.
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Re: William Clay Calling the shots now?

Postby latsprewell20002000 » Mon Nov 26, 2007 9:52 pm

Yeah Kitna is a backup in this league. Thats all there really is to say about him. He has showed leadership this year and that part has been good. His arm strength is terrible though. The ball just floats to the WRs. Its either behind them or too low. Could it be that he doesnt have faith in the guys to throw it when he should and sometimes that means before they are looking at you. Once they are looking at you its usually too late. Now if you have superior arm strength then you can smoke the ball into tight spots. Kitna doesnt have it. AND he needs to go get a sun tan i mean good God man its like you are competely white. Why dont we trade for a young QB and start working on them. Like years like this would have been perfect. I know they dont want to wait a couple years to win but we are going to do that anyways. AND i dont think if we threw Quinn in there or someone like that that they could do just as good as Kitna. I wonder how Millen can sleep at night. If he had any balls he would resign saying " I finally realized that i suck at this job"
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