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Re: League Discussion

Postby flotsamnjetsam » Fri Aug 26, 2011 11:39 am

Toltec wrote:Ahmad Bradshaw - RB, NYG
Contract Length: 5 years
Average Yearly Salary: $9M
Total Contract Amount: $45
2011-2014: $5M; 2015: $25M
NTC: No



This bid is illegal. Backloaded too much...again (last 2 years are more than 60%). Hey Toltec, you are $60+ million under the cap. Why do you keep doing this? :-?



EDIT: I actually deleted that post as Matt was posting this (I was working on a different post), but come on Toltec. YOU DON'T EVEN NEED TO BACKLOAD BECAUSE YOU ARE $60+ MILLION UNDER THE CAP. You can thank me later because I should've just said nothing...and then I would've won Bradshaw due to your illegal bid (if no one else bid). :-t
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Re: League Discussion

Postby Toltec » Fri Aug 26, 2011 11:45 am

mattb47 wrote:
flotsamnjetsam wrote:
Toltec wrote:Ahmad Bradshaw - RB, NYG
Contract Length: 5 years
Average Yearly Salary: $9M
Total Contract Amount: $45
2011-2014: $5M; 2015: $25M
NTC: No



This bid is illegal. Backloaded too much...again (last 2 years are more than 60%). Hey Toltec, you are $60+ million under the cap. Why do you keep doing this? :-?


Yea...and anyway, the whole point of this league is more realism with contracts and salary cap and all that so why do we keep having people so intent on stretching the rules to the limit and doing ridiculous things instead of just playing it like it was meant to be played? :-?

I am playing by the same set of rules as everyone else. This falls under the new amended rules passed to satisfy a loophole. The majority agreed. Why do you have an issue with me working a RB contract to favor me early so I can do a few things with my rookie contracts to maintain a nice cap level for the season and next off-season so I can trade if needed. I am active with this league and in trading so why are you jumping down my throat?
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Re: League Discussion

Postby flotsamnjetsam » Fri Aug 26, 2011 11:52 am

Toltec wrote:
mattb47 wrote:
flotsamnjetsam wrote:

This bid is illegal. Backloaded too much...again (last 2 years are more than 60%). Hey Toltec, you are $60+ million under the cap. Why do you keep doing this? :-?


Yea...and anyway, the whole point of this league is more realism with contracts and salary cap and all that so why do we keep having people so intent on stretching the rules to the limit and doing ridiculous things instead of just playing it like it was meant to be played? :-?

I am playing by the same set of rules as everyone else. This falls under the new amended rules passed to satisfy a loophole. The majority agreed. Why do you have an issue with me working a RB contract to favor me early so I can do a few things with my rookie contracts to maintain a nice cap level for the season and next off-season so I can trade if needed. I am active with this league and in trading so why are you jumping down my throat?



Because of what Matt said.
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Re: League Discussion

Postby terpfan » Fri Aug 26, 2011 12:05 pm

haha yeah I dont so much have a dog in this fight but I'm a little surprised how far some people are under the cap. I would probably be frontloading not backloading...
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Re: League Discussion

Postby mattb47 » Fri Aug 26, 2011 12:11 pm

Exactly...and it's not like I am wanting Bradshaw or trying to bid on him so I don't even have a stake in that discussion but I feel like its just kind of counter to the spirit of the league to put together really screwed up contracts whether it's technically "within the rules" or not. No one is jumping down your throat but I just don't understand why you feel the need to create these screwed up contracts...no one is going to put together a quality team with over 25% of their contracts taken up by 1 mid-tier RB like this. It's not like it's even an upper tier guy or anything and you're giving him the biggest RB contract out there like that.
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Re: League Discussion

Postby Toltec » Fri Aug 26, 2011 12:16 pm

*2010: $7.5 without including signing bonus.
•2011: $5.75 million salary + $4 million roster bonus + $250k offseason workout
•2012: $5.75 million salary + $6 million roster bonus + $250k offseason workout
•2013: $9.75 million salary + $5 million roster bonus + $250k offseason workout
•2014: $9.75 million salary + $5 million roster bonus + $250k offseason workout

Base Salary total for 5 years of $38.5M
Total salary for 4 years with bonuses: $49M (excludes 2010)

So, percent backloaded without bonus: 50.65%
Percentage backloaded with bonus: 57%

That is Tom Brady's contract. The vast majority of NFL contracts look just like this but with smaller numbers.
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Re: League Discussion

Postby Toltec » Fri Aug 26, 2011 12:18 pm

mattb47 wrote:Exactly...and it's not like I am wanting Bradshaw or trying to bid on him so I don't even have a stake in that discussion but I feel like its just kind of counter to the spirit of the league to put together really screwed up contracts whether it's technically "within the rules" or not. No one is jumping down your throat but I just don't understand why you feel the need to create these screwed up contracts...no one is going to put together a quality team with over 25% of their contracts taken up by 1 mid-tier RB like this. It's not like it's even an upper tier guy or anything and you're giving him the biggest RB contract out there like that.

Any other "top 15 potential" starting RBs out there in FA right now? I am open to suggestions.
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Re: League Discussion

Postby flotsamnjetsam » Fri Aug 26, 2011 3:17 pm

Toltec wrote:*2010: $7.5 without including signing bonus.
•2011: $5.75 million salary + $4 million roster bonus + $250k offseason workout
•2012: $5.75 million salary + $6 million roster bonus + $250k offseason workout
•2013: $9.75 million salary + $5 million roster bonus + $250k offseason workout
•2014: $9.75 million salary + $5 million roster bonus + $250k offseason workout

Base Salary total for 5 years of $38.5M
Total salary for 4 years with bonuses: $49M (excludes 2010)

So, percent backloaded without bonus: 50.65%
Percentage backloaded with bonus: 57%

That is Tom Brady's contract. The vast majority of NFL contracts look just like this but with smaller numbers.



VERY bad example...I don't see a 300+% increase in the final year. What are you going to do if we get rid of the AFT, or if we limit the AFT?
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Re: League Discussion

Postby terpfan » Fri Aug 26, 2011 4:02 pm

Haha yeah that Brady contract doesnt look very backloaded to me. I'm not sure I get that as an example.
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Re: League Discussion

Postby WaCougMBS » Fri Aug 26, 2011 4:19 pm

I'm with matt, flots, et al on this point: just because it's in the rules that you can do insane things that stand out and might either help you or ruin you down the road, is that a reason you should do them? This league for a long time has been filled with guys who played "right" and were competitive as hell but never looking for silly loopholes - as I said before, and I like to think of myself as being at least a relatively intelligent guy from time to time, it never even crossed my mind to backload a contract to the extent in question so I could then use the guy for dirt cheap and AFT him the last year. And I don't think ANYONE has done this in this past as it's a pretty glaring instance we wouldn't forget.

So I guess what I'm saying is that I hope there's no prolonged contention over this issue and that we can all go back to (or stay with) the high integrity with which this league is played and not have a lot of this nonsense of searching for loopholes and then pleading that it's "within the rules, so why not?" nonsense. I agree that you can't be held liable for doing so at this point and we can't undo anything crappy that's done like this, but aren't rule changes in a dynasty among friends supposed to be small tweaks to aid in smoothness or running, clarifications of ambiguity, etc. instead of having to stay two steps ahead of someone "hacking" the rules for a competitive advantage?

And for the record, I don't think the people using the NTC on FA bids were doing anything along these lines. It's simply one of those ambiguities we should solve down the road as it really only does make sense for rookie contracts, and everything will be peachy keen. Related question: are we still allowing it on Re-signs for this season and then doing away with it from then on? I can't remember ... Anyway ...

/rant
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