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Re: Rookie RBs

Postby moochman » Tue Sep 16, 2008 9:58 am

As I watched Felix Jones run back a kick off last night I realized I had forgotten him. I am higher on him than many, I think he is but a dinged up Barber away from busting out.
After watching the Lions debacle, episode 2, it looks apparent that Kevin Smith doesn't bring much to the table other than being a starting RB on a team that wants to run. Poor line and a step too slow. Maybe he adusts, but the odds of that are about the same as him losing the job to Rudi Johnson.
I am curious about Jamal Charles. It looks like LJ is being use sparingly on passing downs and those are pretty much every down after the first quarter for the Chiefs. Losing bad QBs to injury isn't a recipe for RB health, but shakey QBs like to check down to RBs in the flat so Charles could have increased value in PPR leagues as the season moves along.
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Re: Rookie RBs

Postby The Lung » Tue Sep 16, 2008 10:42 am

Anyone notice that rookies are 4-5-8-16 in the rushing standings after two weeks? Matt Forte (215 yards), Darren McFadden (210), Chris Johnson (202) Jonathan Stewart (130) all are on pace to exceed 1,000 yards.

And people teased me when I drafted so many rookie RBs this year. :-b
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Re: Rookie RBs

Postby jnormy » Tue Sep 16, 2008 11:35 am

moochman wrote:After watching the Lions debacle, episode 2, it looks apparent that Kevin Smith doesn't bring much to the table other than being a starting RB on a team that wants to run. Poor line and a step too slow. Maybe he adusts, but the odds of that are about the same as him losing the job to Rudi Johnson.


Any chance Marcus Thomas gets thrown into the mix in Detroit at some point this season, or anytime in the future?
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Re: Rookie RBs

Postby Bobbleheadrusty » Tue Sep 16, 2008 12:16 pm

spodog wrote:My rookie RB rankings after 2 weeks of real action:

;-D ;-D ;-D
1. McFadden - looking like he will now own starting role, but OAK won't post the numbers they posted against KC every week
2. C Johnson - lightning fast. TEN's improved DEF will mean they will be running the ball a lot more in Q3 and Q4 of games this yr
3. Forte - solid starter right now, no reason to belive that will change
4. J Stewart - looking like he could take over starting role

;-D ;-D
5. Mendenhall - hold on to him or trade for him. Little value now, but will have late in the year
6. Felix Jones - some believe best ARK running back coming into the draft, plenty of upside, plays on great team

;-D
7. Hightower - eh, need to see more, not sold on this guy yet, but always good to be backing up an aging, injury prone starter
8. Jamaal Charles - LJ now whining about his role, and KC anxious to get this speedy rookie more involved in the offense
9. Ray Rice

:-o = Sweat it out and wait
10. Pierre Thomas
11. Fred Jackson
12. Ryan Torrain - Don't be surprised to still see this guy rushing for 130 ypg in late November, after return from INJ

:-t
13. Slaton - playing in the toughest division in football
14. Kevin Smith - It's Detroit. 8-o


Ummm... Sorry, but you do realize that Pierre Thomas and Fred Jackson arent rookies right? Thomas was a rookie last year and Jackson has been around for a couple years, and had like 500 yards last year.

That and put me in the "Don't believe in CJs hype" camp. He might wind up to be great, but not for long. He just doesnt have the body for any sustained success.
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Re: Rookie RBs

Postby moochman » Tue Sep 16, 2008 1:00 pm

jnormy wrote:
moochman wrote:After watching the Lions debacle, episode 2, it looks apparent that Kevin Smith doesn't bring much to the table other than being a starting RB on a team that wants to run. Poor line and a step too slow. Maybe he adusts, but the odds of that are about the same as him losing the job to Rudi Johnson.


Any chance Marcus Thomas gets thrown into the mix in Detroit at some point this season, or anytime in the future?


Doubtful. NimRod Marinelli has shown little inclination to change things and doesn't appear to even know the O exists. Barring injury, I don't see Thomas getting much play this year.
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Re: Rookie RBs

Postby LS2throwed » Tue Sep 16, 2008 1:09 pm

The Lung wrote:Anyone notice that rookies are 4-5-8-16 in the rushing standings after two weeks? Matt Forte (215 yards), Darren McFadden (210), Chris Johnson (202) Jonathan Stewart (130) all are on pace to exceed 1,000 yards.

And people teased me when I drafted so many rookie RBs this year. :-b



I am also the guy that usually loads up on rookie RB's and I stay away from the Rudi Johnson, Edge, Ahman Greens of the year, I just usually roll the dice in that direction...Stewart and CJ I believed in but I guess I underrated Forte's skillset with surrounding factors, I will be looking to see if he keeps pace with no offensive threat on the outside or competent QB, teams will start stacking the box completely here pretty soon.


Bobbleheadrusty wrote:That and put me in the "Don't believe in CJs hype" camp. He might wind up to be great, but not for long. He just doesnt have the body for any sustained success.



Fair enough, but you do know he's 5'11, 200 lbs right? Same size as Jerious Norwood, Felix Jones, Jamaal Charles, Kevin Faulk, Lorenzo Booker, and plenty of other backs in that same build...Injuries can happen to anyone, Caddillac wasn't a small 200 lb guy but could never get his career off the ground because of it, but his body isn't unusually small or anything...I'm pretty sure Bush came into the league at 200 lbs, now I'm sure he's gained since but I'm pretty sure he wasn't more then that.
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Re: Rookie RBs

Postby jnormy » Tue Sep 16, 2008 1:40 pm

LS2throwed wrote:
Bobbleheadrusty wrote:That and put me in the "Don't believe in CJs hype" camp. He might wind up to be great, but not for long. He just doesnt have the body for any sustained success.



Fair enough, but you do know he's 5'11, 200 lbs right? Same size as Jerious Norwood, Felix Jones, Jamaal Charles, Kevin Faulk, Lorenzo Booker, and plenty of other backs in that same build...Injuries can happen to anyone, Caddillac wasn't a small 200 lb guy but could never get his career off the ground because of it, but his body isn't unusually small or anything...I'm pretty sure Bush came into the league at 200 lbs, now I'm sure he's gained since but I'm pretty sure he wasn't more then that.


Bush this year is listed at 6', 203 lbs. Here are a few more comparables size-wise to CJ who have managed to sustain some degree of success in the NFL:

Westbrook 5'10" 203
MJD 5'7" 208
FWP 5'10" 209
Dunn 5'9" 180
J. Jones 5'10" 208

Now I'm not saying that CJ is a guaranteed star or even an every-down back, but when a runner has the kind of play-making ability that CJ seems to possess, the lack of "ideal" NFL size can often become less of an issue. Plus, by hitting the weight room and following a good training regimen, I'm sure he can easily add some 5-7 pounds while not sacrificing his amazing speed and quickness. It's hard to predict a career length for ANY NFL running back in such a violent, hard-hitting game, but I don't see any reason CJ can't play an important role for the Titans AND for fantasy owners for the next several years... as long as something freaky doesn't happen (à la Caddy).
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Re: Rookie RBs

Postby spodog » Tue Sep 16, 2008 4:17 pm

Bobbleheadrusty wrote:
spodog wrote:My rookie RB rankings after 2 weeks of real action:

;-D ;-D ;-D
1. McFadden - looking like he will now own starting role, but OAK won't post the numbers they posted against KC every week
2. C Johnson - lightning fast. TEN's improved DEF will mean they will be running the ball a lot more in Q3 and Q4 of games this yr
3. Forte - solid starter right now, no reason to belive that will change
4. J Stewart - looking like he could take over starting role

;-D ;-D
5. Mendenhall - hold on to him or trade for him. Little value now, but will have late in the year
6. Felix Jones - some believe best ARK running back coming into the draft, plenty of upside, plays on great team

;-D
7. Hightower - eh, need to see more, not sold on this guy yet, but always good to be backing up an aging, injury prone starter
8. Jamaal Charles - LJ now whining about his role, and KC anxious to get this speedy rookie more involved in the offense
9. Ray Rice

:-o = Sweat it out and wait
10. Pierre Thomas
11. Fred Jackson
12. Ryan Torrain - Don't be surprised to still see this guy rushing for 130 ypg in late November, after return from INJ

:-t
13. Slaton - playing in the toughest division in football
14. Kevin Smith - It's Detroit. 8-o


Ummm... Sorry, but you do realize that Pierre Thomas and Fred Jackson arent rookies right? Thomas was a rookie last year and Jackson has been around for a couple years, and had like 500 yards last year.

That and put me in the "Don't believe in CJs hype" camp. He might wind up to be great, but not for long. He just doesnt have the body for any sustained success.


ok, scratch them off the list.
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Re: Rookie RBs

Postby JasonSeahorn » Tue Sep 16, 2008 4:33 pm

@spodog

What's wrong with Pierre Thomas and Fred Jackson? Thomas looks like he'll get a majority of the goal line carries since McAllister is not really healthy, and Jackson is getting most if not all of the passing down carries so he would be a decent PPR option, not to mention if Bush or Lynch went down, those 2 guys have shown they can be pretty good
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Re: Rookie RBs

Postby Armchair Quarterback » Tue Sep 16, 2008 4:54 pm

JasonSeahorn wrote:@spodog

What's wrong with Pierre Thomas and Fred Jackson? Thomas looks like he'll get a majority of the goal line carries since McAllister is not really healthy, and Jackson is getting most if not all of the passing down carries so he would be a decent PPR option, not to mention if Bush or Lynch went down, those 2 guys have shown they can be pretty good

They aren't rookies.

Pierre Thomas was signed as an undrafted free agent in 2007 and Fred Jackson was originally signed as an undrafted free agent in 2004 by the NIFL's Sioux City Bandits, making stops in the UIFL and NFL Europe before debuting for the Bills last year.
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