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WTF - masking agents

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WTF - masking agents

Postby Spikey_3 » Fri Oct 24, 2008 9:31 pm

Any word on this supposed 18 players failing steroid test and possible for 4 game suspension?????
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Re: WTF

Postby moonhead » Fri Oct 24, 2008 10:05 pm

deuce mccallister is the only name i've heard. i grabbed pierre thomas off waivers immediately.

but all he tested positive for was a masking agent of sorts.
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Re: WTF

Postby shagworth » Fri Oct 24, 2008 10:33 pm

Yeah, from what I hear in Dueces case, he can probably drag out appeals for awhile a la Travis Henry last year. Don't know though, I'm not an expert at the NFL substance abuse policies.
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Re: WTF

Postby WaCougMBS » Fri Oct 24, 2008 10:38 pm

John Clayton reported earlier today that it would likely take 3-4 weeks for everything to shake out, before anything would happen. Unfortunately, depending on who's in trouble, this will likely happen right around the beginning of fantasy playoffs...

Let's cross our fingers on the other 16 guys :-o
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Re: WTF

Postby LS2throwed » Sat Oct 25, 2008 1:26 am

shagworth wrote:Yeah, from what I hear in Dueces case, he can probably drag out appeals for awhile a la Travis Henry last year. Don't know though, I'm not an expert at the NFL substance abuse policies.



I grabbed Pierre too in alot of leagues but again just like you said with the appeal process no telling how long this drags out, but it does look good with Bush out and Deuce maybe about to miss games, and if his value wasn't already looking good I heard from some Saints fans that Stecker may be one of the names not included yet along with Malcolm Floyd, just speculation at this point but Pierre would be the last man standing in this scenario.
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Re: WTF

Postby smackthefirst » Sat Oct 25, 2008 7:29 am

So far I've read the following names as being involved in this with more to obviously come:

Deuce McAllister - Saints RB
Will Smith - Saints DE
Charles Grant - Saints DE
Bryan Pittman - Texans Long Snapper

Of course, none of these names are confirmed, and none of them will be confirmed until they are suspended. What I find interesting though is that 3 of the leaked names are Saints. Anyone want to make a bet that someone within the Saints organization started this leak and will be out of a job by the end of the weekend if they are not out of a job already?

As I hear more rumored names that are involved with this, I will try to update this thread. Right now the biggest name is Deuce, but any bigger names could drastically change the outcome of the NFL season as well as the outcome of our fantasy seasons.
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Re: WTF

Postby moochman » Sat Oct 25, 2008 10:52 am

There are two questions I have.
1) Why would a football player use a diuretic? As part of a weight loss regimen is it worse than useless, it is dangerous for football players who always battle cramping. Cramping comes from low potassium levels and dehydration. Diuretics dehydrate and deplete potassium. So that makes no sense. I must be missing something.
2)Why aren't these players immediately suspended until cleared with a thorough investigation? There is no innocence until proven guilty in the NFL, only conduct becoming of an Goodellian model player. Steriods are banned and should be given more than lip service. Use of a diuretic as an masking agent should also be banned as it posed a threat to the health of users. Immediate suspension would send the message that the league really does want to crack down on steriod use and that it really cares about the well-being of it's players.
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Re: WTF

Postby TheDiplomats » Sat Oct 25, 2008 12:33 pm

moochman wrote:There are two questions I have.
1) Why would a football player use a diuretic? As part of a weight loss regimen is it worse than useless, it is dangerous for football players who always battle cramping. Cramping comes from low potassium levels and dehydration. Diuretics dehydrate and deplete potassium. So that makes no sense. I must be missing something.
2)Why aren't these players immediately suspended until cleared with a thorough investigation? There is no innocence until proven guilty in the NFL, only conduct becoming of an Goodellian model player. Steriods are banned and should be given more than lip service. Use of a diuretic as an masking agent should also be banned as it posed a threat to the health of users. Immediate suspension would send the message that the league really does want to crack down on steriod use and that it really cares about the well-being of it's players.

Bumetanide allows players to mask other drugs they are taking as it flushes out their system. There is a very good chance any of the guys taking Bumetanide were also using Steroids or HGH.
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Re: WTF

Postby LS2throwed » Sat Oct 25, 2008 1:11 pm

TheDiplomats wrote:
moochman wrote:There are two questions I have.
1) Why would a football player use a diuretic? As part of a weight loss regimen is it worse than useless, it is dangerous for football players who always battle cramping. Cramping comes from low potassium levels and dehydration. Diuretics dehydrate and deplete potassium. So that makes no sense. I must be missing something.
2)Why aren't these players immediately suspended until cleared with a thorough investigation? There is no innocence until proven guilty in the NFL, only conduct becoming of an Goodellian model player. Steriods are banned and should be given more than lip service. Use of a diuretic as an masking agent should also be banned as it posed a threat to the health of users. Immediate suspension would send the message that the league really does want to crack down on steriod use and that it really cares about the well-being of it's players.

Bumetanide allows players to mask other drugs they are taking as it flushes out their system. There is a very good chance any of the guys taking Bumetanide were also using Steroids or HGH.



Or marijuana or whatever, Bumetanide makes your body excrete lots of salt and water and will dilute most of the urine samples so nothing will test positive, but the facts are that it is a banned substance, and each player is given a list of which banned substances they are not allowed to take so it's at their own discretion, you can easily go ask someone if what your about to take is OK.


Also, it's not like this is some stuff you can just go grab at GNC, they either got hooked up froma doctor or ordered it overseas online, but they went through a process to get it and if they didn't want to double check to make sure it wasn't on the banned substance list they could of easily found out...I doubt they are getting out of this suspension, probably like most cases they will want to delay it though.
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Re: WTF

Postby smackthefirst » Sat Oct 25, 2008 1:48 pm

moochman wrote:There are two questions I have.
1) Why would a football player use a diuretic? As part of a weight loss regimen is it worse than useless, it is dangerous for football players who always battle cramping. Cramping comes from low potassium levels and dehydration. Diuretics dehydrate and deplete potassium. So that makes no sense. I must be missing something.
2)Why aren't these players immediately suspended until cleared with a thorough investigation? There is no innocence until proven guilty in the NFL, only conduct becoming of an Goodellian model player. Steriods are banned and should be given more than lip service. Use of a diuretic as an masking agent should also be banned as it posed a threat to the health of users. Immediate suspension would send the message that the league really does want to crack down on steriod use and that it really cares about the well-being of it's players.



1) Diplomats and LS2 pretty much covered this one. They primarily use it as a masking agent for other banned substances. And, not to promote a stereotype, but if a player is out of shape and fears losing their spot, common sense doesn't always play a factor in their decisions.

2) In the simplest sense, this is not the American way. In all aspects, you should be considered innocent until proven guilty. Combine that with the laundry list of "regulations and stipulations" the NFLPA has managed to tie into the testing procedure, and the NFL always wants to be more than certain before issuing a suspension because they don't want to lose the inevitable appeal on a technicality. I think it was the THenry case where he was appealing simply based on the fact that a random employee who was to watch him physically take the test was in fact not random. And, if I am not mistaken, the first positive result doesn't result in a suspension. But a second sample, which was taken at the same time, is then tested and if that second sample also tests positive, then a suspension is handed out. And in every case you will most likely see an appeal. Many players and teams realize that the suspension, once issued, is inevitable and by appealing the decision, the team and player can control, to a certain point, the timing of the suspension. For example, if we were between week 12 and week 13, you wouldn't be seeing the appeals by any team looking like a lock for the playoffs because the player and the team would rather take the suspension now to allow the player to be back in time for the playoffs, assuming the normal 4 game suspension.
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