LoveBoatCaptain wrote: Yeah, it's easy to be better than other teams when you know what plays they are running.
Oh come on... they have been an exceptional team for a decade with only Pittsburgh being in the same conversation over the last 10 years.
You are naive if you think New England is the only team to be taping. They all do it, New England just got caught. The difference is that they won.
It's a poor assumption to say that everyone does it just because one team did it. That's hardly an argument one way or another because it's a completely unfounded argument that has no basis in anything.
I agree that you probably can't attribute all of the success to the "spygate" ordeal but it's also impossible to argue that their success doesn't come with an asterisk now because they got caught cheating. It's not people trying to pick a fight...it's just a fact. When people think back on the Patriots in this era, they will always wonder how much they won because of the videotaping...thus the asterisk.
I think it's ridiculous to argue that Pioli doesn't have an excellent eye for talent...this is a team that builds its success on solid drafting and taking older veteran players and making them work together. They have generally done a good job drafting wise and with Pioli being a big part of that, one would have to come to the conclusion that he obviously knows what he's doing.
I just view it slightly differently. While New England did get caught, I believe it is common practise in the NFL. I will concede that not all teams do it to the extrent that NEw England did but I do believe all teams tape otehr teams. I will also concede an asterisk beside the name but it is not probable that it was the key to their success. They are one of the best football teams ever to play in this league.
All division championship seasons. New England is THE team of the decade, sorry Steeler fans.
The Jets won the AFC East in 2002 & the Pats didn't make the playoffs. The Pats won the Super Bowl in the '01, '03, & '04 seasons. I always though it was funny that this "dynasty" didn't even make the playoffs the one year in between their 3 SB wins.
The Jets won the AFC East in 2002 & the Pats didn't make the playoffs. The Pats won the Super Bowl in the '01, '03, & '04 seasons. I always though it was funny that this "dynasty" didn't even make the playoffs the one year in between their 3 SB wins.
The Jets won the AFC East in 2002 & the Pats didn't make the playoffs. The Pats won the Super Bowl in the '01, '03, & '04 seasons. I always though it was funny that this "dynasty" didn't even make the playoffs the one year in between their 3 SB wins.
bungle613 wrote: Oh come on... they have been an exceptional team for a decade with only Pittsburgh being in the same conversation over the last 10 years.
You are naive if you think New England is the only team to be taping. They all do it, New England just got caught. The difference is that they won.
It's a poor assumption to say that everyone does it just because one team did it. That's hardly an argument one way or another because it's a completely unfounded argument that has no basis in anything.
I agree that you probably can't attribute all of the success to the "spygate" ordeal but it's also impossible to argue that their success doesn't come with an asterisk now because they got caught cheating. It's not people trying to pick a fight...it's just a fact. When people think back on the Patriots in this era, they will always wonder how much they won because of the videotaping...thus the asterisk.
I think it's ridiculous to argue that Pioli doesn't have an excellent eye for talent...this is a team that builds its success on solid drafting and taking older veteran players and making them work together. They have generally done a good job drafting wise and with Pioli being a big part of that, one would have to come to the conclusion that he obviously knows what he's doing.
I just view it slightly differently. While New England did get caught, I believe it is common practise in the NFL. I will concede that not all teams do it to the extrent that NEw England did but I do believe all teams tape otehr teams. I will also concede an asterisk beside the name but it is not probable that it was the key to their success. They are one of the best football teams ever to play in this league.
And then there's the fact that numerous well-respected coaches came out and said it was common practice. Jimmy Johnson said on the Fox pregame that his assistants used to rifle through the trash in opposing teams locker rooms after the left. Mora Sr made similar comments on NFLN. And another one that barely got any notice at all was during a CBS broadcast when they showed that teams could legally videotape the opposing sideline, from their own sideline. The issue was that the Patriots guy was on the opposing sideline.
I'm not saying I agree with cheating, or that the Patriots weren't guilty of it, but the fact is waaay more respected coaches and officials of the league came out and supported them, while it was mostly media and fans roasting them.
I agree that you probably can't attribute all of the success to the "spygate" ordeal but it's also impossible to argue that their success doesn't come with an asterisk now because they got caught cheating. It's not people trying to pick a fight...it's just a fact. When people think back on the Patriots in this era, they will always wonder how much they won because of the videotaping...thus the asterisk.
While I agree with you completely matt, you can't really blame Pats fans for coming to the aid of their team. I seem to recall some overly defensive Steelers' fans on here after the officiating in the Super Bowl was called into question.
You can't seriously be comparing outright cheating to some people not liking some referees calls...that's just an awful comparison. When a team has PROVEN to have cheated, it's nowhere near unreasonable for people to then question the success they had while the cheating could have been taking place. If my team got caught doing that...I wouldn't be very quick to come to the defense of them for something like that so I wouldn't quite say that it's just defending your team.
That wasn't the comparison I was trying to make. I just meant that fans will always defend their team. Its no coincidence that its mostly Patriots fans coming out to defend the whole scandal, just like it was no coincidence that it was mostly Steelers fans defending the reffing in both Super Bowls.
portisfan24 wrote:That wasn't the comparison I was trying to make. I just meant that fans will always defend their team. Its no coincidence that its mostly Patriots fans coming out to defend the whole scandal, just like it was no coincidence that it was mostly Steelers fans defending the reffing in both Super Bowls.
Fair enough...but I still maintain that it's not something that I would personally be trying to defend if it was my team. I don't think that defending your team just because it's your team is really a good thing.
The Kansas City Chiefs have signed Matt Cassel to a six year contract with $36 million guaranteed according to the NFL Network and the National Football Post.
The Chiefs dealt a 2nd round pick to the New England Patriots for the right to land Cassel and his $14 million franchise tag. Since then we've gone back and forth on the advantages and disadvantages of getting him locked up in a long-term deal.
This news is breaking just an hour and a half away from the start of the NFL Draft. I would guess this was a fairly easy deal to get done then, maybe even having been completed weeks ago with the Chiefs' keeping in the secrecy theme preferring to wait until draft day to announce it. The Chiefs were actually in danger of not hitting the salary cap floor but depending on the payout of this deal, they probably don't have to worry about that anymore.
The last six year contract signed by a quarterback with this much money guaranteed was Matthew Stafford ($41.7 million) yesterday and Matt Ryan ($34.75 million) last year.
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by bungle613 » Mon Mar 09, 2009 4:13 pm 
