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Wilson: Broncos 'panicked' with Tebow pick

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Re: Wilson: Broncos 'panicked' with Tebow pick

Postby bazzy_51 » Tue May 04, 2010 1:14 pm

It is one of his strengths, but at the same time one of his weaknesses, running. He is such a gifted athlete that at times he may rely a bit too much on his legs. What I mean by this is not the fact that he scrambles too much, because when he does its just either a. a designed play or b. his only other option, but instead that he needs to learn that sliding and losing those extra few yards over diving will better him in the long term.

For this I use AP as a good comparision for one reason, they both need/needed to learn to just run out of bounds or in Tebow's case, slide. He, just like Adrian, instead tries to run through people, which may be ok now because of his body type and physical nature, but later on in his career it will do nothing but wear on him. This is one of his biggest flaws in my opinion, just hit the ground and play for those extra yards on the next play. Adrian was changed, and this is just a flaw that can be eliminated with consistant work on him.

The other one that stands out in my eyes, that most college QBs and even a lot of NFL QBs fail at is field vision. He tends to lock onto receivers too much, rather then scanning the field to pull DBs and LBs off of the routes hes looking for.

One of the other big ones, which I think is just BS, is that hes a lefty and a senior on offense. Those seem to be two big 'unwritten rules' that work against him, outside of Steve Young and Mark Brunell there haven't been many lefthanded QBs to make it big or make it period in the NFL. Also, the 'senior rule' applies to Tebow, just like in the NBA if you look at the NFL for some reason Seniors are really given a bad rep because they actually stayed for 4 years, thus limiting their careers by a year or two. Both of these I think should finally be put to rest, but they are still out there.

Overall this guy showed tremendous poise in the pocket and on/off the field, there aren't too many points to pick out about his actual game play that draw red flags aside from his aggresive, 'run through you', running style and the fact that he tends to lock onto receiving targets a bit too often.
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Re: Wilson: Broncos 'panicked' with Tebow pick

Postby joejlitz » Wed May 05, 2010 11:36 am

bazzy_51 wrote:It is one of his strengths, but at the same time one of his weaknesses, running. He is such a gifted athlete that at times he may rely a bit too much on his legs. What I mean by this is not the fact that he scrambles too much, because when he does its just either a. a designed play or b. his only other option, but instead that he needs to learn that sliding and losing those extra few yards over diving will better him in the long term.

LOL. This reminds me of the job interview where the HR rep says, "What are your weaknesses?"

The response is something like - "Well, I suppose I work such long hours that I don't spend enough time with my family."

PS: AP's biggest flaw is that he is a potential liabilty to fumble a close game away.

PPS: Vick is lefthanded.
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Re: Wilson: Broncos 'panicked' with Tebow pick

Postby bazzy_51 » Wed May 05, 2010 1:22 pm

joejlitz wrote:
bazzy_51 wrote:It is one of his strengths, but at the same time one of his weaknesses, running. He is such a gifted athlete that at times he may rely a bit too much on his legs. What I mean by this is not the fact that he scrambles too much, because when he does its just either a. a designed play or b. his only other option, but instead that he needs to learn that sliding and losing those extra few yards over diving will better him in the long term.

LOL. This reminds me of the job interview where the HR rep says, "What are your weaknesses?"

The response is something like - "Well, I suppose I work such long hours that I don't spend enough time with my family."

PS: AP's biggest flaw is that he is a potential liabilty to fumble a close game away.

PPS: Vick is lefthanded.


@PS: Last year one of the big issues with AP was him trying to freightrain everyone, hell it was even a huge topic right here in the leftovers. I was making a comparision, sorry, but its the truth. When you can slide out get out of bounds, your better off to because the wear and tear on your body in the long run isn't worth those 1-2 extra yards, especially a QB.

@PPS: Yeah and Vick is such a true QB, hes more of a damn RB then Tebow is. I'm just saying its been a topic over the years that south paws aren't looked as highly upon as righties. Lets say the last 15, hell even the last 10 years, how many left handed QBs can you honestly say were top end? I can count on one hand how many that is: Young, Esiason, Brunell and then go back to the late 70's-early 80's with Stabler. 32 south paws total, whether they were big names or not, have played since 1940. Heck there are that many Right handed QBs in one or 2 years. Just saying that 90-92% of all americans are right handed, thus left handed QBs are kind of 'odd' because we just used to training righties.
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Re: Wilson: Broncos 'panicked' with Tebow pick

Postby moochman » Fri May 07, 2010 7:27 pm

Is Tebow really such a gifted athlete? I think that is the biggest concern with him is that he lacks the arm strength, speed, and elusiveness of a Vick, so it is going to be interesting to see how well his skill level measures up against the NFL players.
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Re: Wilson: Broncos 'panicked' with Tebow pick

Postby bazzy_51 » Fri May 07, 2010 11:26 pm

moochman wrote:Is Tebow really such a gifted athlete? I think that is the biggest concern with him is that he lacks the arm strength, speed, and elusiveness of a Vick, so it is going to be interesting to see how well his skill level measures up against the NFL players.


Ok and Tebow is also 6'3" 235-240LBs and Vick is 6'0" 210-215LBs. There is a big difference between Tebow and Vick, and I don't really understand the comparision at all. Aside from both being left handed QBs theres not much of the 'same' in the two. Yes both ran, but both have very different running styles, Vick is a shifty with quick, jerky moves and Tebow is a much more 'what you see is what ya gonna get', upright, smash mouth, bowl you over runner.

Still don't understand the whole 'arm strength' call either. One of his biggest attributes coming out of highschool, thus why he was ranked so high, was his athletic build and arm strength. So unless somehow he lost arm strength while playing 4 years of college football, where he had a much, MUCH strickter conditioning and weight program and was still growing into his body, then I really don't understand these jabs at Tim. Yes he may have more 'ducks' then a Vick or many other QBs on deep throws, but if the ball gets to the receiver and the receiver is able to make a legit play on the ball, then the QB's job is done.

Third, Tebow doesn't need to be elusive. Again he stands 6'3" weighing in at 235ish, hes built, body wise, more like a McNabb/Culpepper then a Michael Vick, thus no need to be pretty. Mooch I dunno if you watched any of these Florida games, and if you did if you even studied Tebow's play before making these comments, but if not you may want to. A gifted athlete doesn't just mean he can run 4.3, make guys break ankles on a juke or throw the ball 80 yards in the air, what a total package athlete has (why Tebow is named a gifted athlete) is also because of his superb knowledge of the game, his leadership and his drive, on top of his physical attributes. Vick shows maybe 1/3 of that, hes not a leader, he doesn't have the field presence that Tebow has showed and he doesn't have that drive.
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Re: Wilson: Broncos 'panicked' with Tebow pick

Postby mattb47 » Sat May 08, 2010 8:05 pm

Tebow is actually a pretty excellent athlete...not the caliber athlete of a Michael Vick, but like bazzy said, Vick makes for a pretty awful comparison outside of them both being left handed and having some skills running the ball. Tebow is more likely to have "Ben Roethlisberger" type elusiveness in the pocket and how well he's able to break tackles in the pocket but he's also a bit more agile and is faster than Big Ben is. He did tie the combine record for vertical jump at the QB position so he's a fantastic athlete, the questions with him aren't about his physical ability, it's about that delivery and his ability to be accurate in tight spots.
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Re: Wilson: Broncos 'panicked' with Tebow pick

Postby Munboy » Sat May 08, 2010 11:57 pm

I think their negatives can be compared. Both lack accuracy (yes Tebow had high completion rates in college, but that's because he only threw high completion passes or he took off running). Which leads to another negative they share...They both look to pull down the ball and take off with it too often.

Honestly, if you want to make a comparison athletically, I think Steve Young (another lefty) would be closer....Except Young was much much MUCH more accurate than Tebow.
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Re: Wilson: Broncos 'panicked' with Tebow pick

Postby mattb47 » Sun May 09, 2010 2:54 pm

Munboy wrote:I think their negatives can be compared. Both lack accuracy (yes Tebow had high completion rates in college, but that's because he only threw high completion passes or he took off running). Which leads to another negative they share...They both look to pull down the ball and take off with it too often.

Honestly, if you want to make a comparison athletically, I think Steve Young (another lefty) would be closer....Except Young was much much MUCH more accurate than Tebow.


Just because his guys were open a lot in college and he didn't need to squeeze passes in to tight spots does not mean he's not able to do it...he's FAR more accurate than Michael Vick was coming out of college...just because he took the high percentage passes that were there and decided not to force passes because he DIDN'T HAVE TO, doesn't mean that he couldn't have or won't at the next level. It was pretty obvious that Vick was a great runner with pretty poor accuracy based on what we saw, basically people are trying to make the same jump based on what we didn't see...just doesn't work that way.
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Re: Wilson: Broncos 'panicked' with Tebow pick

Postby joejlitz » Sun May 09, 2010 4:30 pm

This is such an unwinnable argument not to be resolved until the games start.
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Re: Wilson: Broncos 'panicked' with Tebow pick

Postby da bears » Sun May 09, 2010 4:50 pm

mattb47 wrote:
Munboy wrote:I think their negatives can be compared. Both lack accuracy (yes Tebow had high completion rates in college, but that's because he only threw high completion passes or he took off running). Which leads to another negative they share...They both look to pull down the ball and take off with it too often.

Honestly, if you want to make a comparison athletically, I think Steve Young (another lefty) would be closer....Except Young was much much MUCH more accurate than Tebow.


Just because his guys were open a lot in college and he didn't need to squeeze passes in to tight spots does not mean he's not able to do it...he's FAR more accurate than Michael Vick was coming out of college...just because he took the high percentage passes that were there and decided not to force passes because he DIDN'T HAVE TO, doesn't mean that he couldn't have or won't at the next level. It was pretty obvious that Vick was a great runner with pretty poor accuracy based on what we saw, basically people are trying to make the same jump based on what we didn't see...just doesn't work that way.


Isn't this going to be an issue though if he can't fit the ball into tight spots?(never proven that he can, unless I just wasn't paying attention for 4 years) He doesn't have the athletic ability Vick has or had to make that big play by buying time, he is as you said much more like Big Ben except he doesn't have Ben's arm/accuracy. From what I saw and that's 4 years of watching the guy (I like Urban Meyer so followed them virtually every saturday). Also of concern was the spike in sacks which had a lot to do with his talent at wr/rb dropping off this season compared to his sophomore/junior years. 29 sacks seems like a very high number to me considering the offense they run consists of quick reads and crossing routes off of the option. No need to hang onto the ball that long. Also Bazzy isn't it a little different saying arm strength is a pro going into college as appose to the nfl? I'd say those two are drastically different. Tebow probably will be the best college ball player we'll see at least for a while but I just don't see it translating into nfl success.
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