Can the Eagles win without Vick?

[joejlitz]

I don't know how long he will be out, but with him the Eagles are a 12-win team, IMO.

I think McCoy, Maclin, DJAX, our sick pass rush, and the best secondary in the league will still deliver 10 wins with Vince Young. Anyone else have an opinion?

[bazzy_51]

Young going to be ready to go next week if Vick can't?

I just posted on this somewhere else, but I really don't see Vick being out for any period of time. I understand it was determined he had a concussion, but we've seen much worse in the last few years and seen the player back on the field the next week (and yes I know there is a flips side to that coin). I just don't see, if its a week, it being more then a week.

On to your actual post tho, if Young is healthy I really see him being able to run this team to playoffs. Hell Kafka who was no where NEAR ready to be thrust into a potential come back, game winning drive was able to look good with a few throws. Vick is a huge talent, but the talent around Vick is just as big as he is. McCoy will see more touches, which definitely isn't a bad thing, with more true run plays it will also open up the passing game for Young to see more lanes.

I think tho one player who could make or break a playoff run with Young at helm tho is Celek. If Celek doesn't step up to his potential in the passing game I think it may hamper a bit. That WR core is solid top to bottom, but Brent could make a huge difference for the Eagles.

I don't know as much about the Eagles as many other here do, but what I have seen in two games this year and a couple preseason games with Young at helm, he has the talent around him and the talent within himself to do it.

[mattb47]

I think Vick is worth more than 2 wins which is what you're saying he's worth by saying their a 12 win team without him and a 10 win team with him. Sure they have a lot of talent but that defense is VERY susceptible to the run and for how great they are in coverage, I think teams can and will find ways to pass on them like Matt Ryan was able to at times today. I think without Vick they are maybe able to squeeze into the playoffs, I think if they went the rest of the year without Vick they would go maybe 9-7 as I think Vick is just a difference maker for that team in so many ways.

Part of the reason those receivers can have all that success and McCoy can have all that success is because every team's gameplan is completely focused on how to stop Michael Vick. You take that away and teams can and will shut this team down.

[joejlitz]

I think Vick is worth more than 2 wins which is what you're saying he's worth by saying their a 12 win team without him and a 10 win team with him. Sure they have a lot of talent but that defense is VERY susceptible to the run and for how great they are in coverage, I think teams can and will find ways to pass on them like Matt Ryan was able to at times today. I think without Vick they are maybe able to squeeze into the playoffs, I think if they went the rest of the year without Vick they would go maybe 9-7 as I think Vick is just a difference maker for that team in so many ways.

Part of the reason those receivers can have all that success and McCoy can have all that success is because every team's gameplan is completely focused on how to stop Michael Vick. You take that away and teams can and will shut this team down.

McCoy and DJAX were quite successful with McNabb. That's not the issue.

Also, you might be right about the 9 wins, but I think the difference with/without Vick is the difference between a dominant team and one that gets the job done. i.e. 12 wins while kicking many teams butt, or 10 wins with a lot of close calls.

As for the run, the Eagles have always been unsuccessful against the run under Andy Reid. They have a "bend, don't break" philosophy that is to bulk up on DBs and the pass rush. It's ok to give up 5-8 yard runs from time to time - even 15-20, just don't give up the big pass play; the playmakers will eventually get a sack, tackle for a loss, or turnover. Then, get the ball back to the offense, get an early lead, and force the other team to pass into our strength.

That's always been their style with Reid and their rush defense is no worse this year (or maybe not much worse) than it has been in the years we went 13-3 (1 time), 12-4 (2 times), 11-5 (3 times), and 10-6 (2 times). So, they've been 10-6 or better 8 times since 2000 when Andy Reid got here. Their rush defense would worry me, too if I wasn't used to seeing the Eagles game plan every week for 11 years under Reid. I think that part will be ok.

The question for me is, when we get the ball back, will we be able to take advantage of it and force them into throwing? If so, we win. If not, we lose.

[Dolfan19]

Young is a winning QB who looked really good in the preseason. Eagles shouldn't have a problem getting 12 wins with either Young or Vick.

[OldManRiver]

However Young still has a lingering hammy injury and has himself said he doesn't have a complete grasp of the offense. If Vick doesn't play next week im quite sure Kafka would get the start with us bringing in another QB or maybe just having Ronnie brown be our backup.

[Stevooo]

Give the rock to McCoy and ride him for a few weeks.

[DraftDodger]

They can win without Vick (if it comes to that) but I'm not sure they can win without Vick or Young. Kafka shows a lot of promise but you'd hate to throw him into the fire right now. That said, the Eagles have stacked their team with talent, and I'm confident they'll continue to field a competitive team.

[16FAC]

The real question is: Would the Eagles have to change their game plan without Vick? I think the answer is yes and I don't like the odds of Young or Kafka running the ball. That means McCoy gets a heavier dose between the tackles and as well as he does in that limited role, I'm not sure the team wants to thrust him into a position similar to Adrian Peterson when he is accostomed to the "Brian Westbrook" role.

[mattb47]

Sorry, but Vince Young is no Michael Vick and does not and will not command the kind of respect from defenses that Vick currently does. The entire gameplan of opposing defenses has to do with how to stop Vick and contain him, with Young back there teams will be happy to just keep him from running and making him beat them through the air and concentrate on coverage. It changes the ENTIRE dynamic of the Eagles offense and their defense has done nothing to instill any confidence whatsoever. They may go with the bend but not break but with those CBs they were supposed to be a shut down defense as far as passing goes but they're not. They are particularly weak against TEs and RBs both rushing and receiving and I don't think they have the same kind of ability to just outscore teams without Vick like they do with him.