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Tom Brady vs. Peyton Manning

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Re: Tom Brady vs. Peyton Manning

Postby mattb47 » Sun Feb 05, 2012 1:39 pm

I don't know mooch, I think that the defenses Peyton had were definitely comparable to the kind of defense the Pats have this year except they just couldn't stop the run instead of not being able to stop the pass. The Giants defense is not even close to being in the same conversation with being as bad as either of those defenses so it's hard to go there and make that comparison. And honestly, I really think that Peyton hasn't had nearly the caliber of "talent" that most people seem to attribute to the Colts over the years...I think he has had a big hand in making those guys look better than they are. I mean how many guys have left Indy and done ANYTHING anywhere else...I think the best talent they had over the years was Edgerrin James at RB in his prime, but even then every team had to worry about Peyton so much that he had way more room to run.

Even as consistent as guys like Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne have been over the years, they weren't overly fast or overly talented, but they benefited from playing with Peyton all those years.

I think Eli vs Peyton could turn into an interesting debate one day, but I do think that Eli has always had the benefit of a better defense than Peyton has had and has had better receiving talent overall over the years as well.
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Re: Tom Brady vs. Peyton Manning

Postby lmcjaho » Sun Feb 05, 2012 3:51 pm

I'll preface this with the following personal comment - I hate the Patriots with a burning passion.

That being said, the whole idea of this thread is laughable - Peyton doesn't hold a candle to Brady.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/w ... index.html
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Re: Tom Brady vs. Peyton Manning

Postby scottaa1 » Sun Feb 05, 2012 4:05 pm

That article reeks of being written by someone from Boston.
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Re: Tom Brady vs. Peyton Manning

Postby mattb47 » Sun Feb 05, 2012 5:38 pm

I'd love to see an analysis of the average length of Manning's passes vs. Brady's passes too. The Patriots offense relies VERY heavily on a whole lot of short passes and getting lots of YAC from their receivers. An offense built on that premise certainly lends itself to fewer errant passes and mistakes overall as well.

The knock on Manning for years was that he couldn't perform in the playoffs like he did in the regular season...what about Brady now? He's been downright mediocre in the playoffs for years and years...as the defense has started to go downhill, so has the Pats playoff successes overall. We'll see this year if he can overcome it but even so, this has a similar look to the championship the Colts won where they had a historically bad defense all season and for some reason the light clicked on in the playoffs and they started playing a whole lot better to help them move on into the playoffs.
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Re: Tom Brady vs. Peyton Manning

Postby scottaa1 » Sun Feb 05, 2012 10:03 pm

moochman wrote:I think the stronger arguement may be which Manning is the better QB?


and this question comes to the forefront suddenly, moochtradamus.
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Re: Tom Brady vs. Peyton Manning

Postby moochman » Sun Feb 05, 2012 11:09 pm

mattb47 wrote:I don't know mooch, I think that the defenses Peyton had were definitely comparable to the kind of defense the Pats have this year except they just couldn't stop the run instead of not being able to stop the pass. The Giants defense is not even close to being in the same conversation with being as bad as either of those defenses so it's hard to go there and make that comparison. And honestly, I really think that Peyton hasn't had nearly the caliber of "talent" that most people seem to attribute to the Colts over the years...I think he has had a big hand in making those guys look better than they are. I mean how many guys have left Indy and done ANYTHING anywhere else...I think the best talent they had over the years was Edgerrin James at RB in his prime, but even then every team had to worry about Peyton so much that he had way more room to run.

Even as consistent as guys like Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne have been over the years, they weren't overly fast or overly talented, but they benefited from playing with Peyton all those years.

I think Eli vs Peyton could turn into an interesting debate one day, but I do think that Eli has always had the benefit of a better defense than Peyton has had and has had better receiving talent overall over the years as well.


Its not cut and dried, by no means, but Eli was instrumental in winning two Superbowls. Say what you will about receivers, Eli has never had a TE like Dallas Clark, nor the WRs like Harrison or Wayne. Remember all the stories about Peyton and Marvin running their plays pregame, thousands of reps. Name me one receiver on the Giants that won a title with Eli in 2008? Try none. So while Peyton had HOFers that he was uber familiar with, Eli has been doing it with relative strangers. And look at today's game, think back to '08, Eli was throwing some pretty important passes right where they had to be. Gosh, the more I think about it, the more I have lean toward Eli as the better of the Mannings.
As for Brady, he is now 0-2 post-Spygate. Starting to build up some tarnish.
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Re: Tom Brady vs. Peyton Manning

Postby moochman » Sun Feb 05, 2012 11:22 pm

scottaa1 wrote:
moochman wrote:I think the stronger arguement may be which Manning is the better QB?


and this question comes to the forefront suddenly, moochtradamus.



moochtradamus! lololololololololololololol

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Re: Tom Brady vs. Peyton Manning

Postby mattb47 » Mon Feb 06, 2012 8:32 pm

moochman wrote:
mattb47 wrote:I don't know mooch, I think that the defenses Peyton had were definitely comparable to the kind of defense the Pats have this year except they just couldn't stop the run instead of not being able to stop the pass. The Giants defense is not even close to being in the same conversation with being as bad as either of those defenses so it's hard to go there and make that comparison. And honestly, I really think that Peyton hasn't had nearly the caliber of "talent" that most people seem to attribute to the Colts over the years...I think he has had a big hand in making those guys look better than they are. I mean how many guys have left Indy and done ANYTHING anywhere else...I think the best talent they had over the years was Edgerrin James at RB in his prime, but even then every team had to worry about Peyton so much that he had way more room to run.

Even as consistent as guys like Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne have been over the years, they weren't overly fast or overly talented, but they benefited from playing with Peyton all those years.

I think Eli vs Peyton could turn into an interesting debate one day, but I do think that Eli has always had the benefit of a better defense than Peyton has had and has had better receiving talent overall over the years as well.


Its not cut and dried, by no means, but Eli was instrumental in winning two Superbowls. Say what you will about receivers, Eli has never had a TE like Dallas Clark, nor the WRs like Harrison or Wayne. Remember all the stories about Peyton and Marvin running their plays pregame, thousands of reps. Name me one receiver on the Giants that won a title with Eli in 2008? Try none. So while Peyton had HOFers that he was uber familiar with, Eli has been doing it with relative strangers. And look at today's game, think back to '08, Eli was throwing some pretty important passes right where they had to be. Gosh, the more I think about it, the more I have lean toward Eli as the better of the Mannings.
As for Brady, he is now 0-2 post-Spygate. Starting to build up some tarnish.


See though...it's all about where you put more of the credit though. I mean for me personally, I don't think that these guys we're talking about (Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, Dallas Clark, etc) are as talented as many think them to be because of the successes they've had. I mean they were and are good players but I think a whole lot of their success had more to do with who was throwing them the ball all those years. This year Reggie Wayne happened to "look older" and couldn't get open as often...was that because he all of a sudden fell off a cliff or because he didn't have the QB throwing him open all the time like Manning always does? Same with Dallas Clark, all of a sudden he was a virtual non-factor in the passing game without Manning throwing the ball. I mean those QBs weren't anything special but guys as successful as those guys were should have still had SOME success with a lesser QB.
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Re: Tom Brady vs. Peyton Manning

Postby scottaa1 » Mon Feb 06, 2012 8:50 pm

mattb47 wrote:
See though...it's all about where you put more of the credit though. I mean for me personally, I don't think that these guys we're talking about (Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, Dallas Clark, etc) are as talented as many think them to be because of the successes they've had. I mean they were and are good players but I think a whole lot of their success had more to do with who was throwing them the ball all those years.


That's another point I agree with. Manning rose the level of play for those around him. Think back to the 80's tech explosion... Manning is IBM, and those guys are Intel. IBM gave them success.
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Re: Tom Brady vs. Peyton Manning

Postby moochman » Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:06 am

scottaa1 wrote:
mattb47 wrote:
See though...it's all about where you put more of the credit though. I mean for me personally, I don't think that these guys we're talking about (Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, Dallas Clark, etc) are as talented as many think them to be because of the successes they've had. I mean they were and are good players but I think a whole lot of their success had more to do with who was throwing them the ball all those years.


That's another point I agree with. Manning rose the level of play for those around him. Think back to the 80's tech explosion... Manning is IBM, and those guys are Intel. IBM gave them success.


as long as you don't use the example of Manning is Google and those guys Yahoos lol. Does that mean that Eli is Apple? Speaking of apples, you Matt, are not trying to compare Wayne, Harrison and Clark to pick any set of Giant receivers you want, are you? It can't be argued that Peyton helped elevate their games, but the Giants can't hold a candle to them. Its a very tough measure to make given the different offensive philosophies. Imagine what kind of QB Peyton would have been under Coughlin and Parcels? not the gun slinger he turned into.
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