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NFL to use scab referees to start season

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Re: NFL to use scab referees to start season

Postby moochman » Wed Sep 26, 2012 6:49 pm

The league isn't giving the refs pension benefits, they are reducing them. Here is a decent, albeit a tad long-winded article on the dispute, from Michael Hiltzik of the Los Angeles Times. http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-p ... 919.column

Excerpts;
It's about employers' willingness to resort to strong-arm tactics with workers, because they believe that in today's environment unions can be pushed around (they're not wrong).


They've mentioned that the refs are part-timers who are somehow able to pull down an average $150,000 each to work the games. They've noted that the league's generous contract offer would raise that average to more than $200,000 in seven years.


Although the league offered an overall raise, it has also proposed to add 21 men to the officiating roster, which it says would give it more flexibility to sit refs out of games or sack sub-par officials.


One major issue is the NFL's insistence on changing the retirement plan for all refs from a traditional defined-benefit plan, based on the employees' pay and years of service, to a 401(k)-style defined-contribution plan. The defined-benefit plan covering existing refs would be frozen and terminated — they'd get what they've earned so far, but no more. The referees union has already agreed to the changeover for all newly hired members but proposes to grandfather the old plan for existing refs, allowing them to continue to accrue benefits.


Like I said, wordy. But those are some good points in the dispute that illustrate the leagues position is the same of big business today. A classic maneurver to destroy the retirements of the people who helped the company's prosper. Bottom line is all that matters, and is isn't the refs bottom line, or the fans bottom line (which would be the best return on their entertainment investment, or better football)
Heck, a parallel could even be made to outsourcing and sending teams to London to play. Someone in the USA lost work for each of those games.
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Re: NFL to use scab referees to start season

Postby stomperrob » Wed Sep 26, 2012 7:38 pm

Not many businesses provide pensions for part time workers, he** not many unions even ask for such a thing! And I wouldn't mind $200,000/year for a part time job!!!
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Re: NFL to use scab referees to start season

Postby moochman » Wed Sep 26, 2012 7:47 pm

stomperrob wrote:Not many businesses provide pensions for part time workers, he** not many unions even ask for such a thing! And I wouldn't mind $200,000/year for a part time job!!!


Falling right into the league's trap. Part-tme vs full-time is subtrafuge. They are counting on average joes to be misdirected. I have said it before and will always stick by it, you cannot compare professional athletes with ordanary people. Same for the refs. They are paid for performance only. And they are well worth it, as it turns out. Don't let the league fool ya into focusing on some PI penalty that way missed while they try and force-feed that Tate scored legitimately.
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Re: NFL to use scab referees to start season

Postby stomperrob » Wed Sep 26, 2012 7:57 pm

moochman wrote:
stomperrob wrote:Not many businesses provide pensions for part time workers, he** not many unions even ask for such a thing! And I wouldn't mind $200,000/year for a part time job!!!


Falling right into the league's trap. Part-tme vs full-time is subtrafuge. They are counting on average joes to be misdirected. I have said it before and will always stick by it, you cannot compare professional athletes with ordanary people. Same for the refs. They are paid for performance only. And they are well worth it, as it turns out. Don't let the league fool ya into focusing on some PI penalty that way missed while they try and force-feed that Tate scored legitimately.


...and don't let the refs fool you - most of those guys have full time jobs - teachers, lawyers, etc, etc. There has been talk of full time refs like other sports, but until that happens they are just part time employees, nothing more nothing less - and don't forget in other sports the refs have to work more than one game a week unlike the NFL, full time working only one game a week is kinda cushy compared to MLB, NBA and NHL (and of course a lot more travel is involved in those sports, more time away from home).

I've worked management, union and even union busting - ain't no one pullin' the wool over my eyes just 'cause I see it different from ya!
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Re: NFL to use scab referees to start season

Postby moochman » Thu Sep 27, 2012 4:44 pm

Seeing it different for sure, rob, but still falling for the camiflage. It makes no difference if they have other jobs or not. Has nothing at all to do with the now settled dispute. Here are details on the settlement, via espn. http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/84298 ... nd-lockout

The current defined benefit pension plan will remain in place for current officials through the 2016 season (or until the official earns 20 years of service). The defined benefit plan will then be frozen

Retirement benefits will be provided for new hires, and for all officials beginning in 2017, through a defined contribution arrangement, which will have two elements: an annual league contribution made on behalf of each game official that will begin with an average of more than $18,000 per official and increase to more than $23,000 per official in 2019, and a partial match on any additional contribution that an official makes to his 401(k) account.

compensation will increase from an average of $149,000 per year in 2011 to $173,000 in 2013, rising to $205,000 by 2019

Beginning with the 2013 season, the NFL will have the option of hiring a number of officials on a full-time basis to work year-round, including on the field

The NFL will have the option to retain additional officials for training and development purposes, and may assign those additional officials to work NFL games. The number of additional officials will be determined by the NFL.


So it looks like a compromise on each side regarding pensions, which will be phased out. Happy to have this done and over.
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Re: NFL to use scab referees to start season

Postby stomperrob » Thu Sep 27, 2012 5:38 pm

moochman wrote:Seeing it different for sure, rob, but still falling for the camiflage. It makes no difference if they have other jobs or not. Has nothing at all to do with the now settled dispute. Here are details on the settlement, via espn. http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/84298 ... nd-lockout

The current defined benefit pension plan will remain in place for current officials through the 2016 season (or until the official earns 20 years of service). The defined benefit plan will then be frozen

Retirement benefits will be provided for new hires, and for all officials beginning in 2017, through a defined contribution arrangement, which will have two elements: an annual league contribution made on behalf of each game official that will begin with an average of more than $18,000 per official and increase to more than $23,000 per official in 2019, and a partial match on any additional contribution that an official makes to his 401(k) account.

compensation will increase from an average of $149,000 per year in 2011 to $173,000 in 2013, rising to $205,000 by 2019

Beginning with the 2013 season, the NFL will have the option of hiring a number of officials on a full-time basis to work year-round, including on the field

The NFL will have the option to retain additional officials for training and development purposes, and may assign those additional officials to work NFL games. The number of additional officials will be determined by the NFL.


So it looks like a compromise on each side regarding pensions, which will be phased out. Happy to have this done and over.


Nah, we just have to agree to disagree - just 'cause I don't see it the way you do doesn't make me wrong or gullible.

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Re: NFL to use scab referees to start season

Postby moochman » Thu Sep 27, 2012 7:44 pm

sorry if I offended. was not my intent. Nor do I feel I am attacking inmaginary foes. Probably over-reacted after the league trying to deflect from the botched TD call by saying they missed an PI call. A clear attempt to avert people from the main issue. So when its brought up that refs are part time or make too much money, I was just trying to redirect to the main issue. Sorry if my jousting got out of hand. I dismount from my high horse and beg forgiveness :-b
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Re: NFL to use scab referees to start season

Postby stomperrob » Thu Sep 27, 2012 8:41 pm

moochman wrote:sorry if I offended. was not my intent. Nor do I feel I am attacking inmaginary foes. Probably over-reacted after the league trying to deflect from the botched TD call by saying they missed an PI call. A clear attempt to avert people from the main issue. So when its brought up that refs are part time or make too much money, I was just trying to redirect to the main issue. Sorry if my jousting got out of hand. I dismount from my high horse and beg forgiveness :-b


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