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Postby BESMIRCHED » Wed Dec 24, 2003 12:11 am

i really want gb to make the playoffs instead of the seahawks... after watching MNF

it is highly unlikely that minnesota will lose to arizona...although anything can happen in the NFL...

hopefully green bay wins against denver...tough match though or
seattle loses to SF

does anyone know who makes the playoff if green bay and seattle both wins?
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Postby VHawk15 » Wed Dec 24, 2003 12:16 am

If both teams win, I believe that the Pack goes. And I think we all know who I want to get the play-off berth. Go Broncos!
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Postby 49ers Forever » Wed Dec 24, 2003 12:39 am

If both teams win, the seahawks can still make the playoffs if the Steelers and Saints win. Strength of schedule thing.
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Postby KingGhidra » Wed Dec 24, 2003 12:42 am

49ers Forever wrote:If both teams win, the seahawks can still make the playoffs if the Steelers and Saints win. Strength of schedule thing.


How exactly? Green Bay beat them straight up, which is the first playoff tie breaker.
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Postby 49ers Forever » Wed Dec 24, 2003 12:59 am

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Postby Shaffe » Wed Dec 24, 2003 3:14 am

here's how it works i think. this is just going off of my knowledge.

if minn, gb, and sea win;
-minn wins the division because of better NFC record (4th tiebreaker)
-gb wins the wild card by virtue of a head to head victory

if minn loses, gb and sea win;
-gb wins the division outright, no ties
-sea wins wid card outright

if minn and sea lose, gb wins;
-gb wins division outright
-minn wins wild card by virtue of head to head matchup

if minn, sea, gb all lose;
-gb wins division by common opponent's victory (9-5 against san fran, denver, san diego, oakland, st. louis, seattle, kc, 'zona, and divisonal games v.s. minn's 8-6)
-minn gets wild card by h2h matchup

so basicly seattle is real screwed unless one of the two loses, in which case they get in if they win their game. it's real crazy, if you want the tiebreaking procedures, here they are. go figure it out yoursef if you like in case i'm wrong.

http://www.nfl.com/standings/tiebreakers
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Postby KingGhidra » Wed Dec 24, 2003 3:57 am

49ers Forever wrote:Ghidra, here's the link

http://www.superbowl.com/news/story/6863112


Okay, you didn't specify Dallas losing, which is what I thought would be the only possible scenario.

Basically...

If Seattle, Minnesota and Green Bay each win, and Dallas loses Sunday at New Orleans, all four teams would finish 10-6. In that case, Minnesota would be the NFC North winner, while the Seahawks and Dallas would be the wild cards.

That doesn't seem right does it?
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Postby BESMIRCHED » Wed Dec 24, 2003 12:47 pm

so basically...if sea loses they are out...they will have to either win/or and get A LOT of help...

wouldnt it be something if minnesota loses to arizona...LOL...and sea and gb both win
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Postby fantasizing » Wed Dec 24, 2003 2:23 pm

[quote]
Basically...
If Seattle, Minnesota and Green Bay each win, and Dallas loses Sunday at New Orleans, all four teams would finish 10-6. In that case, Minnesota would be the NFC North winner, while the Seahawks and Dallas would be the wild cards.

That doesn't seem right does it?[/quote]

That is right if you look at:
http://www.superbowl.com/playoffs/features/seeding/nfc

except that Seattle has to have the higher strength of victory over Dallas to make it.

I'm not quite sure why Seattle beats out Green Bay because Green Bay beat Seattle in a head to head, unless the tie breaker goes according to "Three or More Clubs" rules below. In that case, the head-to-head doesn't apply for three teams (Seattle, Green Bay, and Dallas) because Green Bay did not beat Dallas OR Seattle did not lose to Dallas during the regular season.

from http://www.nfl.com/standings/tiebreakers:

TO BREAK A TIE FOR THE WILD-CARD TEAM
If it is necessary to break ties to determine the two Wild-Card clubs from each conference, the following steps will be taken.
1. If the tied clubs are from the same division, apply division tie breaker.
2. If the tied clubs are from different divisions, apply the following steps.

Two Clubs
1. Head-to-head, if applicable.
2. Best won-lost-tied percentage in games played within the conference.
3. Best won-lost-tied percentage in common games, minimum of four.
4. Strength of victory.
5. Strength of schedule.
6. Best combined ranking among conference teams in points scored and points allowed.
7. Best combined ranking among all teams in points scored and points allowed.
8. Best net points in conference games.
9. Best net points in all games.
10. Best net touchdowns in all games.
11. Coin toss.

Three or More Clubs
(Note: If two clubs remain tied after third or other clubs are eliminated, tie breaker reverts to step 1 of applicable two-club format.)
1. Apply division tie breaker to eliminate all but the highest ranked club in each division prior to proceeding to step 2. The original seeding within a division upon application of the division tie breaker remains the same for all subsequent applications of the procedure that are necessary to identify the two Wild-Card participants.
2. Head-to-head sweep. (Applicable only if one club has defeated each of the others or if one club has lost to each of the others.)
3. Best won-lost-tied percentage in games played within the conference.
4. Best won-lost-tied percentage in common games, minimum of four.
5. Strength of victory.
6. Strength of schedule.
7. Best combined ranking among conference teams in points scored and points allowed.
8. Best combined ranking among all teams in points scored and points allowed.
9. Best net points in conference games.
10. Best net points in all games.
11. Best net touchdowns in all games.
12. Coin toss
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Postby 4Pack » Wed Dec 24, 2003 2:29 pm

A 3 way tie can only happen if Minnesota, Seattle and Green Bay wins and Dallas loses. That is the only way. Any other scenario than that...and a 3 way tie is not possible.

Now...about that "Strength of Victory" tiebreak that John and Al talked about Monday night in the event of a 3 way tie. John and Al were doing a little hypeing of the game between the Ravens and the Steelers. While that game MAY very well determine weather or not the Packers get in the playoffs...alot has too happen in the previous games on Saturday and SUnday too make that game be the deciding factor for the Packers playoff chances.

With a 3 way tie...Green Bay is INITIALLY out of the of the playoffs because the Packers have the worst conference record of the 3 teams. At that point...a 2 way tiebreaker starts between Dallas and Seattle. The loser of that tiebreak then goes too a 2 way tiebreaker with Green Bay. If Seattle wins the tiebreak with Dallas....then Dallas beats Green Bay due too a better conference record. If Dallas wins the tiebreak with Seattle...we beat Seattle due too our win against them. (As you see...Dallas is in either way).

Sooooo...for Green Bay too get in...Dallas MUST beat Seattle in the initial 2 way tiebreak between them. That winner will be determined by "Strength of Victory" between those two teams. "Strength of Victory" is the won-loss record of teams that Dallas and Seattle have beaten. This is why a bunch of seemingly meaningless games this weekend (i.e. Baltimore and Pittsburgh) are important now.

Sooo...after further research...here is what I have come up with that the Packers need too have happen in the 3 way tie event.

Giants over Carolina
Jets over Miami
Bills over NE
Washington over Philly
Detroit over Saint Louis
KC over CHicago
Cincy over Cleveland
Baltimore over Pittsburgh

If 5 or more of the above happen...the Green Bay is in the playoffs. If 3 or less happen...then Green Bay is out. If 4 happen...then their is a tie between Dallas and Seattle and they then progress to the next tiebreak which is "Strength of Schedule" between Dallas and Seattle.

Now...I could be wrong on this...but that is how I have deciphered it! LOL! Feel free too correct me! What a mess the NFL has come up with!
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