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The NFL is just plain wrong here.........

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Postby Buckychudd » Wed Apr 21, 2004 12:07 am

Flux wrote:Are you saying this should be the age to participate in ALL professional sports? or just the NFL? You still could apply the same argument no matter what age you are. A 17 year old can easily be as physically gifted or mentally gifted as an 18 year old. If you open this up to allow 18 year olds, it wont stop there, and if you think it will, you need a reality check.

As for your arguments
A) How do you know nobody will ever be that gifted, did people really think a 14 yr old could play pro tennis or pros soccer? In female gymnastics, the best athletes may be pre-teens
B) It was thought that it would be unlikely for an 18 yr old to be drafted. But now it could happen. Who is to say that there wont be some 6'4 300lb 14 yr old who could play in the NFL? Unlikely? Yes, but what do you do when he wants to play? You cant just pick and choose ages and arguments here. Whatever is decided HAS TO BE ALL ENCUMBERING.


It will stop there if the NFL wants it to. The 18 year age of majority has been long recognized in this country.....plenty of precedent to fall back on.

A) As you pointed out earlier.....different sports. B) I think you mean encompassing......and as I pointed out the age of majority has been recognized for a long time, very easy to make that the cutoff.

Flux wrote:My argument isn't flawed. You are the one stating its not a maturity issue, not me. Your interpretation of my argument is flawed. Btw, you said
this isn't a mautrity issue ment to protect the kids
at least you admit that they are KIDS

My quote about the kids was meant as sarcasm, which aparently doesn't come off well when written. You know "but we must protect the children" - picture me imitating a 40 yo middle-class women saying that.....then you should get it.

What I am saying is that you're fooling yourself by saying it's a maturity issue.....you have a vested interest in protecting the product and you are falling back on the maturity issue to make yourself feel better about being selfish. I have no compunctions about admitting I'm selfish.

Either way we can let the market settle this....if all the 18 yo's that enter the league end up failing, they won't be entering the league for long because there will be no demand for them.
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Postby awwchrist » Wed Apr 21, 2004 12:14 am

Any of you guys see Outside the Lines tonight? They discussed this with a panel of Jim Brown, Robert Smith, and Randy Mueller.

It was a good 10 minutes.
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Postby Buckychudd » Wed Apr 21, 2004 12:40 am

awwchrist wrote:Any of you guys see Outside the Lines tonight? They discussed this with a panel of Jim Brown, Robert Smith, and Randy Mueller.

It was a good 10 minutes.

Didn't see it.....I'm just guessing Brown was on Clarett's side?
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Postby awwchrist » Wed Apr 21, 2004 12:47 am

Vehemently.
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Postby Flux » Wed Apr 21, 2004 7:49 am

It will stop there if the NFL wants it to. The 18 year age of majority has been long recognized in this country.....plenty of precedent to fall back on.

A) As you pointed out earlier.....different sports. B) I think you mean encompassing......and as I pointed out the age of majority has been recognized for a long time, very easy to make that the cutoff.


If the NFL can stop it there, they should be able to stop it wherever they want. I understand what you are saying about 18, but that age isn't really a benchmark anymore. Right or wrong kids (and i do mean kids here) are being sent to jail as adults before they are 18. If someone can go to prison for life shouldn't they also be allowed to play in the NFL? Granted it is different than voting or going to war, but there will be exceptions to every rule.

A) So are we completely picking and choosing what arguments we will and will not accept here? I was not the original person to bring up comparisons of the sports, but everyone on your side seems to be saying that if you can do it in other sports you should be able to do it in the NFL. I was just saying that there could be some freak of nature who could handle the NFL at the age of 14. Do you have the right to deny him?

B) Yes i did mean encompassing, it was late, a thousand pardons. Although encumburing actually fits in with this issue, i just used it incorrectly.

My quote about the kids was meant as sarcasm, which aparently doesn't come off well when written. You know "but we must protect the children" - picture me imitating a 40 yo middle-class women saying that.....then you should get it.


I actually did get it after reading it a second time which is why i took it out of my post

What I am saying is that you're fooling yourself by saying it's a maturity issue.....you have a vested interest in protecting the product and you are falling back on the maturity issue to make yourself feel better about being selfish. I have no compunctions about admitting I'm selfish.


I don't think i have a vested interest in protecting the product. To bring up other sports again, this year was the first year I actually watched the NBA in over 4-5 years. Why? b/c King James and Carmello.

Could there be a potential HS player who could play in the NFL and actually increase the level of the 'product'? Absolutely. But an age restriction HAS to be in place. I really don't think its as simple as just saying 18.

Before it was just saying 3 years removed from HS. Now all of a sudden thats not fair. If we say 18, do you think a lot of these great players will actually finish out HS? If a 16 or 17 year old has the talent to play in the NFL (like i said there are exceptions to EVERY rule) and they are not booksmart, like you said before, is it fair to deny them? That would spur on this exact same discussion again.
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Postby Flux » Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:14 am

This seems to be just going in circles, so I think I'm done w/ this maturity issue. I do believe you make some very valid points, so in the end its just a difference in opinion.

Right or wrong, for whatever reason, we will find out this summer what is legal. We can debate and bicker, but in the end, none of us actually have a say in it.
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Postby Buckychudd » Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:19 am

Flux wrote:This seems to be just going in circles, so I think I'm done w/ this maturity issue. I do believe you make some very valid points, so in the end its just a difference in opinion.

Right or wrong, for whatever reason, we will find out this summer what is legal. We can debate and bicker, but in the end, none of us actually have a say in it.

Yeah, I was coming to the same conclusion.....helped me flesh out my thoughts though.
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Postby maddog60 » Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:33 am

Just my two cents:

THe NFL is the employer, and obviously the players are employees of it. Employers have the right to set requirements for their entire employee base. For instance, I am going to college for a degree in computer science. Why? Because the employers I wish to work for won't hire me unless I have the degree. Its one of my requirements for being employed.

The NFL has obviously different requirements for employement. Mainly physical standards as they are the most important skills for the sport. However, beign 3 years removed from highschool is one of their requirements. It doesn't violate any ammendments with unfair discrimination, so it's a legally justified requirement.

To allow Maurice Clarrett into the draft on the basis that the NFL shouldn't be allowed to have such a requirement for its employees, sets a dangerous precedent. Who's to say that any employer can require a degree then if someone has the necessary skills? It follows from the same logic as letting Clarrett in, and has far reaching consequences.

Furthermore, on the issue brought up that requiring a degree isn't something important for professional football players, I would be to differ. Unlike most jobs, football isn't a career that will last 30 years. Also, it comes with a much higher risk of career-ending injury than most any job. This is a profession where 30 year olds have to consider retirement. Requiring a degree (which they dont) would make sense in that they want to make sure all of their employees have an insurance policy for the risks of their profession.
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Postby Pete123444 » Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:59 am

i don't believe clarrett is allowed to sell beer here in va till he's 21 either.lawsuit there too??
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Postby Plindsey88 » Wed Apr 21, 2004 9:01 am

maddog60 wrote:Just my two cents:

THe NFL is the employer, and obviously the players are employees of it. Employers have the right to set requirements for their entire employee base. For instance, I am going to college for a degree in computer science. Why? Because the employers I wish to work for won't hire me unless I have the degree. Its one of my requirements for being employed.



Age discrimination in the workplace is illegal.
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