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More fuel for the Manning debate

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More fuel for the Manning debate

Postby maddog60 » Mon Apr 26, 2004 3:22 pm

Thought this was a well thought out counterpoint to the popular stance being taken on Eli Manning:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=d ... &type=lgns
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Postby Mercer Boy » Mon Apr 26, 2004 4:11 pm

Dan Pompei wrote:Speak up and you are a whiner. A politicker. An elitist. A weasel. You think you are bigger than the league. You act like you are a member of the NFL's version of the Kennedy family. You have a meddling father and a money-grubbing brother. You probably club baby seals for kicks. Oh, and you suck! You suck! You suck!


That was pretty funny.

The reason people are mad is because there are very few players that care about where they go. They're just happy to be playing in the league for goodness sake! Sure, they'd like to go somewhere and win right away, but it doesn't always work that way. If everyone said "I only want to go to these teams," then we would only have about four teams that are any good.

The idea of the draft is to make cruddy teams more competitive by giving them the chance to get the best young talent. So when someone "steps up" to say they don't want to play somewhere, it makes them look like they have no respect for the process and only care about themselves. As I have said before, if you think you're that good, take the team you get drafted to and make them a winner. If you can do that, you'll be accoladed as a great football player.
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Postby SeaWolf » Mon Apr 26, 2004 7:56 pm

Mercer Boy wrote:
Dan Pompei wrote:Speak up and you are a whiner. A politicker. An elitist. A weasel. You think you are bigger than the league. You act like you are a member of the NFL's version of the Kennedy family. You have a meddling father and a money-grubbing brother. You probably club baby seals for kicks. Oh, and you suck! You suck! You suck!


That was pretty funny.

The reason people are mad is because there are very few players that care about where they go. They're just happy to be playing in the league for goodness sake! Sure, they'd like to go somewhere and win right away, but it doesn't always work that way. If everyone said "I only want to go to these teams," then we would only have about four teams that are any good.

The idea of the draft is to make cruddy teams more competitive by giving them the chance to get the best young talent. So when someone "steps up" to say they don't want to play somewhere, it makes them look like they have no respect for the process and only care about themselves. As I have said before, if you think you're that good, take the team you get drafted to and make them a winner. If you can do that, you'll be accoladed as a great football player.


ditto


I would like to add that the NFl is like one employer. I work for a major telecommunication company. I don't get to choose where I get to work. My senority tells me where I get to work. I may not like where I'm at or what I'm doing, but it's a job. Same with the NFL. Sometimes you get to play where you want to play, then when you have "senority" you can become a FA and negociate to go where you wish. Everyone looks at the NFL as 32 different companies, you should only look at it as one big corporation.
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Postby proKrastinate » Tue Apr 27, 2004 10:25 am

SeaWolf wrote:
Everyone looks at the NFL as 32 different companies, you should only look at it as one big corporation.


EXACTLY
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Postby maddog60 » Tue Apr 27, 2004 10:41 am

SeaWolf wrote:I would like to add that the NFl is like one employer. I work for a major telecommunication company. I don't get to choose where I get to work. My senority tells me where I get to work. I may not like where I'm at or what I'm doing, but it's a job. Same with the NFL. Sometimes you get to play where you want to play, then when you have "senority" you can become a FA and negociate to go where you wish. Everyone looks at the NFL as 32 different companies, you should only look at it as one big corporation.


Well first off, I think that considering the NFL one employer, not 32 seperate employers is a faulty analogy to other job situations. If someone wants to make a career playing football, the only job market is the NFL. Granted there are other places in the industry, like Arena League, but for someone who went to say, Miami, spent 3-4 years in college training for their job, playing Arena League Football instead of NFL would be like if I spent 4 years getting a Bachelors degree in Computer Science, then went on to work at a help desk troubleshooting computer complaints :-t

But for arguments sake, I will concede to you the point that the NFL should be viewed as one employer. So you have one employer with outfits in many different cities (32 to be exact). Let's generalize this scenario for a moment. You've just finished college, you have your degree, you want to work for this one particular employer. You live in for arguments sake, south Jersey. Now, this employer has an outfit in Philadelphia, so you would when interviewing apply for a position in that outfit (assuming you weren't planning on recolating for reasons such as: family is close by, fiancee has a job in the area already, etc). The point is, you get to make that choice to apply for positions that are geographically convenient to you. So, yes you do get to dictate where you work. NFL draftees however hve very little say, which is why they have rules such as opting to sit out a year.
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Postby SeaWolf » Tue Apr 27, 2004 12:15 pm

maddog60 wrote:
SeaWolf wrote:I would like to add that the NFl is like one employer. I work for a major telecommunication company. I don't get to choose where I get to work. My senority tells me where I get to work. I may not like where I'm at or what I'm doing, but it's a job. Same with the NFL. Sometimes you get to play where you want to play, then when you have "senority" you can become a FA and negociate to go where you wish. Everyone looks at the NFL as 32 different companies, you should only look at it as one big corporation.


Well first off, I think that considering the NFL one employer, not 32 seperate employers is a faulty analogy to other job situations. If someone wants to make a career playing football, the only job market is the NFL. Granted there are other places in the industry, like Arena League, but for someone who went to say, Miami, spent 3-4 years in college training for their job, playing Arena League Football instead of NFL would be like if I spent 4 years getting a Bachelors degree in Computer Science, then went on to work at a help desk troubleshooting computer complaints :-t

But for arguments sake, I will concede to you the point that the NFL should be viewed as one employer. So you have one employer with outfits in many different cities (32 to be exact). Let's generalize this scenario for a moment. You've just finished college, you have your degree, you want to work for this one particular employer. You live in for arguments sake, south Jersey. Now, this employer has an outfit in Philadelphia, so you would when interviewing apply for a position in that outfit (assuming you weren't planning on recolating for reasons such as: family is close by, fiancee has a job in the area already, etc). The point is, you get to make that choice to apply for positions that are geographically convenient to you. So, yes you do get to dictate where you work. NFL draftees however hve very little say, which is why they have rules such as opting to sit out a year.


I would like to add that I work next to the Boeing company. They just reasigned my wife's step father. He now has to commute 1hr farther than before. Now just because you go for an interview in Philly, that doesn't mean they won't move to Pittsburgh.
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Postby maddog60 » Tue Apr 27, 2004 1:31 pm

SeaWolf wrote:I would like to add that I work next to the Boeing company. They just reasigned my wife's step father. He now has to commute 1hr farther than before. Now just because you go for an interview in Philly, that doesn't mean they won't move to Pittsburgh.


True, companies can move, but you do pick your initial locale. Being reassigned to a new outfit could be compared to being traded. The company relocated could be compared to when teams move to new cities. But in the end you choose where you go originally, something Eli Manning is being vilified for trying to assert some degree of control over.
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Postby TheRawDAWG » Tue Apr 27, 2004 6:58 pm

Maddog60, you are making it seem like Manning said where he wanted to play. He didn't care where he played as long as it wasn't SD. Thats alot different then applying for a job in a certain area. Oh and people in real world jobs don't get to say, ' Well I know you're paying me 10 million dollars, but I don't want to work in this city. I want to work in this other city for 10 million dollars.' In most businesses that guy would be laughed at and thrown on his ass for the next guy.
So they weren't the best...and may have ended the worst. SO WHAT!
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Postby TheHeat24 » Tue Apr 27, 2004 10:11 pm

Manning is a big baby and I hope he falls flat on his face... The NY media would rip him a new one...
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Postby proKrastinate » Tue Apr 27, 2004 11:53 pm

maddog, i applaud you for atleast trying to make a strong argument with some good analysis. At this time however I think there are just too many people who are too heated to this debate. hehe, its almost like a religon in a sense that once your in your ways, thats all that you will hear.
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